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Seikilos
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PostSubject: Short questions, short answers...   Tue 1 Apr 2014 - 11:11

Hi,

I know this kind of thread in many forums and I hope, me and everybody else could post short questions here, which can be answered shortly. So if you have only one or two questions, you have not to start a new thread?


My first little questions:


1) If a model has two or more attacks, do they attack simultaniously or in an order chosen by the attacker?

2) Where can you find rules for the "bazar of the bizarre"?

3) Are wounds on models with more than one wound regenerated between battles?

4) Do warhounds (bought from equipment list) count against the maximum number of models in a warband?


Thank you,
Seikilos
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Tue 1 Apr 2014 - 11:49

1) Simultaneously.
2) Do you mean this thing? It is the only Bazaar of the Bizarre I can think of.
3) Yes. Also, can be regened with healing herbs during the game. Note that, unless you use a house-rule, Healing herbs are not consumed on use. Most people house-rule it. My group does not, but have not found it unbalanced.
4) Yes.
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Seikilos
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Thu 3 Apr 2014 - 13:10

Thank you!



Next question:

Can heroes be rebought, except for the Chieftains/leaders?
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Thu 3 Apr 2014 - 13:11

Yes
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Mike
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Thu 3 Apr 2014 - 15:16

A related question: if a hero replaces a leader, does he also still count as his base hero slot? As in a mercenary champion replaces the deceased leader of a warband. Is the warband allowed to hire another champion or does the new leader still occupy the champion position?
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Thu 3 Apr 2014 - 17:20

They still occupy the champion position, they've just gained the 'Leader' ability.  

Similarly, if a henchman from a group with a limited number becomes a hero they still count towards the limit for that type of henchman, eg a Possessed warband Beastman promotes to a hero.  That warband can recruit two more Beastmen before they reach the maximum of three allowed (1 hero + 2 henchmen).
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 5 Apr 2014 - 14:03

If a model with Frenzy and the Jump Up skill is wounded and a 1-2 is rolled for injury, do they still lose Frenzy?
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 5 Apr 2014 - 19:57

RAW, no, because the wording for Jump Up says they ignore the result of knocked down. You may or may not wish to house-rule this. In my group we house-ruled that the model is considered knocked down, but may instantly stand up and fight without initiative penalty. The biggest thing this opens up is if you are fighting close to the edge you will have to do an I test to make sure you don't fall.
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 5 Apr 2014 - 23:14

I like your house rule, Lord 0. It is called 'jump up' after all which implies that the warrior was knocked down even though RAW it says otherwise.
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Seikilos
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Fri 11 Apr 2014 - 1:39

Hi,

my shaman has the fouth spell of the spells of chaos (in german: "Verlockung des Chaos").

If I have one model of the enemy, what happens to it, if the shaman dies and he fails his LD-test? Do I still have control about it?
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Fri 11 Apr 2014 - 8:57

Yes. In Mordheim there is no rule saying a spell ends because the caster dies or is removed from the table. You may or may not want to house rule this.
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Fri 11 Apr 2014 - 9:08

For Fear, is the roll made each combat phase or just on the initial combat phase?
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Fri 11 Apr 2014 - 9:30

Just the initial.
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Fri 11 Apr 2014 - 12:44

For warhorses, the Battle Trained ability only helps with the Loss of Control test required for models that do not have the Skill Ride: Horses. It does not provide a re-roll on the Woah Boy! table. Could someone please confirm. Thanks.
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Fri 11 Apr 2014 - 16:17

To ride a Warhorse that has the Battle Trained special rule you would need Skill Ride: Warhorse. If so then it would provide the re-roll. Someone with Skill Ride: Horse should not be able to ride a warhorse with that special rule.
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Von Kurst
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Fri 11 Apr 2014 - 17:23

Blazing Saddles wrote:
SPECIAL RULES

Battle Schooled: The mount has been specially trained to fight on a battlefield. The rider may re-roll any failed loss of control tests. Only one re-roll is allowed per test.

Controlling a Mount. The Special Riding Skills may be used by warriors who have a riding animal, but only after the skill Ride has been gained; warriors which come provided with a riding animal are assumed to possess the Ride skill already. Warriors without this skill may still ride animals, but must test against their Leadership if hit by any missile and at the beginning of any combat phase when a standing enemy is in base contact. If the test is failed they lose control of their mount and must roll on the Whoa, Boy! Table (see below). Note if an enemy is not standing, the mounted warrior is not considered to be in combat and thus does not need to test for loss of control.

The Blazing Saddles rules are another in a long series of poorly written GW rules. The Battle Schooled rule refers to "loss of control tests" which is the Leadership test refered to above (maybe/maybe not). Either way, rules as written it is NOT a roll on the Whoa Boy table.

Mike wrote:
To ride a Warhorse that has the Battle Trained special rule you would need Skill Ride: Warhorse. If so then it would provide the re-roll. Someone with Skill Ride: Horse should not be able to ride a warhorse with that special rule.

Actually if you have the skill Ride Warhorse you are not affected by the loss of control rule as noted in the rule quoted above. If you do not have the specific Ride skill THEN the warhorse's training may keep you from losing control by failing a Leadership test.

Finally the person who posted this question should check with the person who is running the campaign as he may have some house rules for mounts that we don't know about here. Lord knows that using the Blazing Saddles rules is torture without some.
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Fri 11 Apr 2014 - 23:46

Von Kurst wrote:
The Blazing Saddles rules are another in a long series of poorly written GW rules.  The Battle Schooled rule refers to "loss of control tests" which is the Leadership test refered to above (maybe/maybe not).  Either way, rules as written it is NOT a roll on the Whoa Boy table.
I looked at those same rules this morning and was going to copy them into a post. The rules are terribly written like you said and I actually gave up on writing a post instead of trying to put some sense into the rules. Sad 
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 12 Apr 2014 - 3:35

Seikilos wrote:
Hi,

my shaman has the fouth spell of the spells of chaos (in german: "Verlockung des Chaos").

If I have one model of the enemy, what happens to it, if the shaman dies and he fails his LD-test? Do I still have control about it?
This is from Mordheim Annual 2002
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 12 Apr 2014 - 6:36

Mounted Rules - Loss of Control Checks Summary

This is the summary write-up I did for the GM of the game. I think it's a properly supported understanding. Thanks everyone for your thoughts.

Loss of Control check is not the same as Woah Boy! roll, which is the roll required if the Loss of Control check fails. Loss of control check is required for any mounted model that was:
1) hit by any missile in the shooting phase, or
2) in base-to-base contact with an enemy that is not knocked down, stunned or OoA at the start of close combat phase.

A Loss of Control check is made if hit or at the start of close combat phase if applicable. If the roll fails, then you roll on the Woah Boy! table. (page 24 - Controlling A Mount)

So, Warhorses are battle trained, this means they can re-roll Loss of Control checks (1 re-roll limit). (page 28 - Warhorse/Battle Trained)

The Loss of Control check can be negated if the model has the skill Ride: Horses/Warhorses (or whatever the applicable mount is). (page 25 - Ride skill under Cavalry Skills).

Additionally, if a mounted model suffers it's last wound then it rolls on the Woah Boy! table (page 26 - Loss of Control).
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 12 Apr 2014 - 10:44

Also, are models that have warhorses are part of their initial equipment tables assumed to have the Ride: Warhorse skill inherently?
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 12 Apr 2014 - 13:34

Finally, when does a rider recover for a result of 1-2 on the Woah Boy, when does the unit recover.
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 12 Apr 2014 - 17:16

klinktastic wrote:
Also, are models that have warhorses are part of their initial equipment tables assumed to have the Ride: Warhorse skill inherently?
Warriors that come with a mount automatically come with the applicable "Ride xxx" skill. The Mordheim Errata updates the rules for the Freelancer hired sword to show this is the case. However, if a warrior simply has mount as part of their equipment list then they do not start with the appropriate ride skill. Being able to purchase a mount for that warrior does not guarantee that the warrior can ride that mount.

klinktastic wrote:
Finally, when does a rider recover for a result of 1-2 on the Woah Boy, when does the unit recover.
It is my understanding that the entire unit cannot be used in the next turn for that player. This is a worse result then a normal warrior being Knocked Down. The rules are below for everyone.

Quote :
The rider is temporarily disorientated and his mount rears up. The rider keeps his seat but must spend his next turn stationary regaining control, unable to move or shoot. If attacked, treat the rider as fallen down.
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 12 Apr 2014 - 17:57

RL wrote:
Warriors that come with a mount automatically come with the applicable "Ride xxx" skill. The Mordheim Errata updates the rules for the Freelancer hired sword to show this is the case. However, if a warrior simply has mount as part of their equipment list then they do not start with the appropriate ride skill. Being able to purchase a mount for that warrior does not guarantee that the warrior can ride that mount.

Some unofficial warbands specifically include the appropriate skill when you purchase a warrior who can use mounts as starting equipment, for example, the Relics of the Crusades Turjurk warband. I have no idea if the Bretonnians in your campaign have such a rule or not. It is also common for groups to house rule this since many warbands were written before the Blazing Saddles rules, thus such skills were not needed to ride mounts you could purchase as starting equipment.
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 12 Apr 2014 - 18:07

+1 VK
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PostSubject: Re: Short questions, short answers...   Sat 12 Apr 2014 - 19:54

Thanks guys, that helps a lot. It would make sense that the Woah Boy table is a little worse than the injury table for the non-mounted. Being mounted comes with a lot of benefits, it would make sense that the trade off is opposingly as tough.
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