Square grid Mordheim?

Ok. I know this may sound heretic for some of you out there, but...

Lots of "other companies" game systems has totally left behind the "guess range", or "declare your intentions before measuring" issue.

Actually, many games mechanics allow pre-measurement ANY TIME during the game (or maybe just during your turn), but GW still features this as one of their prime points in their games.

But it seems to me that pre-measurement, or an actual grid on the tabletop (squares or hexes) will hardly harm the enjoyment of the game, and maybe delete a lot of discussions about movement, missile ranges, charge moves or spell effects.

So... what do you think?

Is a square grid on the tabletop worth a try, or you think this can turn the game to a boardgame?

Tnx and best wishes.

Grids on the tabletop are a no go for me. They are ugly and totally destroy the atmosphere.

I love the guessing, honestly. But it's all up to you and your gaming group!

Look at it this way...

That slayer wont know if he can charge across that small bridge to get into combat with the gunnery school of Nuln without getting shot...But with squares he will!

I think it takes a lot out of the game, to be honest. I mean, I play some games that use a square grid and they're still fun, but I like that in GW games you can move fluidly throughout the table. Even though in a grid-based game, you can still move to almost anywhere on the board, you're restricted in the directions and routes you have to take. There are a predetermined, finite number of spots where my model can stop, for example. I couldn't have him end his turn between squares, or on the intersection of 4 different squares, to get in just the right spot to have cover but still get LoS. The range of movement is just far more limited.

It's a carry over from Warhammer, where movement is everything and a key part of strategy in the game. I also think it kind've takes some of the fun out of it as well if you 'knew' you could charge, or know you are gonna get charged next turn if you don't move. It's also impacts shooting somewhat (Although, not as much in Mordheim where you have to target the closest enemy).

Also, it's not a common feature in all Games Workshop systems. Lord of the Rings allows for measuring whenever you want. There's also of course, Bloodbowl that uses a grid, but that's really something pretty different.

Most of the games I have played that allow pre-measuring are more abstract. For example, Flames of War. A single base represents 4 or 5 guys usually. The time represented by a single turn is not fixed, pre-measuring represents shooting a few bullets to feel out the distance. The actual roll represents the overwhelming fire all the guys in the squad can pump into the chosen target over how ever long that turn lasts. In a small skirmish game like Mordheim, a single turn represents a very small allotment of time, and each base is a single miniature. Each shot represents a single shot. If it is wasted on a figure too far away it is wasted.

I don't feel that pre-measuring really throws off the tactical balance of the game all that much. More often than not, it's pretty clear whether or not you're in charge range, or if your enemy is within range to be shot at. This is especially true for those of us that have been playing these games for some time now, and are good at estimating ranges. The only time measuring and pre-measuring really seems to come up, for us, is when you're in that grey area that's give-or-take about an inch from the required distance.

Grids have their uses, just not in mordheim, i'm too worried without thinking i put in some X's and O's or try to connect 4 guys in a row (Poor boardgame puns)

I'm sure a "grid" can throw away some people, but there are certain ways to do it without it looking odd.

In this very forum there are people that have covered an entire table with 1" cardboard squares!

And others that have carved cobblestones on styrofoam, or... well, you get the idea.

I believe that if well done, the board will look amazing and not like a "chess" board.

AND the "grid" idea is more in this form:

http://www.barrule.com/workshop/scratch%20builders%20paradise/sheet%20materials.html

FBS706 Stone Sets 7mm O Gauge

although the squares will of course be 1", not 7mm.

Or this:

http://www.stonehouseminiatures.com/buildingsruins/

http://www.stonehouseminiatures.com/newbuildings/item.nhtml?profile=newbuildings&UID=108

Yes, the tabletop is marked in 1.5" hexes, but irregular enough as to look "natural" cobblestones. I really like it.

About "guessing" ranges, if yuo have been playing for a while, just as Myntokk says, you become pretty good calculating ranges.

Worst still, if you have a pal that works as carpenter, or any other job that needs constant measurements, they have an unfair advantage over the rest of the gamers.

And to think that a marksman don't know the effective range of his weapon, even when he has trained so hard to master it, mmmm...

Or that a warrior will run wildly towards his enemy, but when he ALMOST reach him he suddenly lose all impetus and recoils half the distance, C'MON, GIVE ME A BREAK.

The "your shot (or charge move) is 1/16" short, so you miss completely" is, to say the least, irritating.

Moreover, A grid will make things soooo much easier for newbies.

But then, this was only an idea to make things simple.

I may buy a cheap fabric and make the grid just for fun and see how it feels in an actual game, before trying something else.

Best wishes.

But how would you continue the patterning inside houses? On upper floors? When going up stairs and ladders? I think this would over complicate things... Simply using the continues 3D world is fine by me, with or without pre-measuring...

Jadex, the games we play usually are ground level 90% + of the time, so no big deal with upper floors for us.

You may want to check my other thread

Do you play on above ground levels?

https://boringmordheimforum.forumieren.com/rules-and-gameplay-f1/do-you-play-on-above-groud-levels-t2974.htm

AND if you are doing this, buildings CAN have a grid too. I may draw with pencil some grid on my old cardboard MORDHEIM BOX buildings, to test the idea.

Consider all ladders 2 "squares" to move up or down one level (supposed to be 2" anyway), miniatures can be placed on our stairs, so each step counts as a square, etc.

In the end, maybe is too much work, and we only will allow pre-measurements, as the other games we use to play allow that.

Best wishes.