Of flagellants and mushrooms

Hey guys, I was just skimming through the rulebook and noticed this: the flagellant's fanatic rule states he always passes Ld-based tests. Am I missing something or can I just feed him Madcap Mushrooms without worrying about possible stupidity, since stupidity only ever affects you when you fail a Ld test?

Rulebook p.36 wrote:

Side effect: After the battle, roll a D6. On a roll of a 1
the model becomes permanently stupid.

It does not matter if the flagellant automatically passes all his Ld test under normal circumstances. If you roll a 1 the flagellant gains the stupidity rule and thus will need to take Ld tests against his Ld of 10, regardless of the Fanatic rule.

I hope that helps!

Unless there is some specific errata Admin Tom is in the wrong.

If a model automatically passes all LD-based tests, as the rulebook says, then the LD-based test, which is part of the Stupidity-rule would of course count as an LD-based test.

Technically, the model will still have the Stupidity special rule, and would still be subject to the penalties of Stupidity if it somehow failed the test. But as Stupidity is only triggered by a failed LD-test, this will never be relevant.

I side with Asp on that matter.
Stupidity requires you to pass a Ld-Test, and Fanatical lets you pass every test, so you are automatically passing every stupidity test. This does not mean that the Flagellant does not get the Stupidity rule, just that it doesn't have any effect.

I agree with what Asp and Eliazar said.

Technically speaking, you should pass all stupidity tests automatically.

But I don't think this is how it should be played. Just as 1+ armour saves are not passed automatically (1 is still a fail), you should not be able to pass Ld test automatically in this case.

In my opinion a flagellant that turns stupid, should be affected by this rule in game, because:

1. The abovementioned "loophole" is so obvious, that I highly doubt that it follows the spirit of the game.

2. There is a Ld value in the flagellant's profile for a reason. Here's your chance to use it.

3. It gives the warrior some character compared to the other henchmen in his group. After all, why should frenzy prevent a warrior from being stupid, and drooling a little between fights?

4. It will save you a lot of arguing with your oponent. In the light of "generosity" I would just take the test, so that there is no arguing about it (that might potentially ruin the game). Besides, are you REALLY afraid of failing a Ld10 test? Come on...

5. I don't like power-gaming.

So technically, you can argue that stupidity tests do not affect the flagellant.

I personally would not play it like that though.

I agree with that, too. With Ld 10, there's little chance of failure anyway.

It's just fair, and logical. After all, their just so fanatical they don't care about anything, but if their brain gets a little fried by the mushroom side effects, they can't help it but drool a little in between

However, it is always good to note how it's written and how it should be. But interesting find, Hans!

Eliazar wrote:

interesting find, Hans!

True!

Well since henchmen can't use equipment the point is moot unless said flagellant becomes a hero first.

Once he bocomes a hero (a scary one at that!), based on the spirit of the rule it says they fear nothing in this world, so they pass all leadership tests. Stupidity isn't something you can bravely set aside in the face of terror!

Pathfinder Dubstyles wrote:

the point is moot unless said flagellant becomes a hero first.

Good point. See, I completely missed that.

Pathfinder Dubstyles wrote:

Stupidity isn't something you can bravely set aside
in the face of terror!

That's my understanding too.

I agree with Pathfinder Dubstyles completely, better yet I even think that the stupidity makes a really nice addition to a Frenzy character, you are awesome in combat, but don't even know how to put on your clothes in the right way...

I don't mean to nit-pick on Gilzenaar, so no offense intended. The discussion was not on Frenzy vs. Stupidity, but Fanatic vs. Stupidity.

But just so future readers are clear; a model with frenzy and stupidity will be affected by stupidity as normal until they are within charge range, at which point they are immune to all other psychological conditions except frenzy.

Thanks for agreeing with me completely by the way!

lol, srry for my misunderstanding