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 Rout tests and flagellants?

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meerkat
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PostSubject: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 5:29

In a witch hunters warband, if the captain is stunned or out of action, can I then take rout tests on a flagellant's leadership of ten? Flagellants can't be the leader of a warband, but I can't see anything stopping me from using their leadership in this case.

Thanks in advance!
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Cavonius
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 6:17

I don't see why you can't.

During a game a feew weeks ago we were in the same situation.

And we checked it up, and there is nothing that says you can't in the rulebook.

If they have changed it it might be in some errata och something.


So, yes you can.
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Ezekiel
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 6:29

I don't think so actually.. as their ld of ten points to their unbreakable minds due to serious sick visions of the world... not something to aim for as a warband...

(plus, I thought you'd need to use heroes LDs before henchmen LDs??
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Asp
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 6:56

flagellants should simply have immune to psychology instead of the current many lines of text
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meerkat
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 8:56

The rules just say to use the highest leadership in your warband (once the captain is out of it). So maybe the flagellant's grim determination to die in battle causes the warband to stay to the bitter end!

I can't find anything in the errata to the rulebook either.
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 9:49

Yes, by the book you can use your Flagellant's LD. However, I would personally house-rule against it. I believe the fluff of the rule implies that using the next-highest LD characteristic represents a lieutenant type attempting to rally the troops. A flagellant would never be that guy. Sure you can come up with believable fluff about "grim determination," but it seems against the spirit of the warband.

More to the point, it seems overpowered and unfair that in killing your leader your opponent finds himself facing down a better LD test from a model that explicitly cannot act as leader.
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 11:35

I too think that it's not really into the spirit in the game to use a psychopath's LD over a leader's. however it doesn't say you can't. I think you should houserule something about this with your Gaming group.

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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 11:54

I also think, that it should be next hero in the rank whose Ld should be used, not henchmen. IMHO flagellants have such high Ld because they are supposed never to use it in the first place.

While we touched the leader, Ld & rout test topic, I put my question here rather than creating another thread: what happens, when hero who's not a leader, gains higher Ld value due to experience progress? Do you still have to test rout test against leadr's Ld?
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Von Kurst
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 12:03

@Aldhick--yes you still use the Leader's characteristic. Very realistic. (Although I often have them fight a duel for the leadership of the gang when that happens, but that's just me.)
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 13:47

I'd say that a rout test is psychology? And since flaggelants are immune they can't take the test..
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Myntokk
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 13:58

Von Kurst wrote:
(Although I often have them fight a duel for the leadership of the gang when that happens, but that's just me.)
Weren't there optional rules posted for this somewhere, or am I thinking of Necromunda?
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 17:17

Our own house interpretation of this - not official by any means.

1. Since human max Leadership is 9, reduce Flagellant's Leadership to 9.

2. When the Leader is OOA, only use the highest Leadership among the Heroes.

3. Rout tests, while based upon a leader's Leadership, are for the entire warband, therefore Immune to Psychology and the like does not grant auto-success for Rout tests. However, whoever rolls the Rout test can use personal re-roll abilities, even a Rabbit's Foot for one of the two dice. We think of it like this: the leader is encouraging his troops to stay - he can use all the abilities at his beck and call (like luck) to do so, but it is ultimately the collective decision of all the troops whether they rout or stay (so personal immunity to rout does not translate to warband immunity to rout).

4. While Flagellants cannot become warband leaders, they can become Heroes. If so, and the warband Leader is OOA when a Rout test is required, we can use the Hero Flagellant's Leadership.
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Asp
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 20:24

flagellants should have ld 6-7 and immune to psychology

its the rational solution. all else is clutter

ipt does NOT give immunity to rout tests. (otherwise the undead with vampire would never rout)
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perfesser
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Wed 30 Sep 2009 - 23:43

Asp wrote:
its the rational solution. all else is clutter
Well, I don't know if everything else is clutter, but from a costing perspective flagellants are very attractive. Being able to use that LD 10 for rout tests is a little over the top, I'd say.

Mind you, Witchhunters have a lot of disadvantages as a warband. So using that flaggellant LD once in a blue moon isn't really something to worry to much about I'd think.
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Thu 1 Oct 2009 - 3:38

This is more contentious than I thought!

So essentially, the rules allow it but probably shouldn't.
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wyldhunt
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PostSubject: Re: Rout tests and flagellants?   Thu 1 Oct 2009 - 19:28

You have it.
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