I am not left-handed either! (the tactician skill)

One of the most interesting and yet underwritten skills in Mordheim is
'Tactician,' an academic skill found in the annual. Here's the text for
reference:

Quote :

Tactician: This skill may only be taken by a warband leader. The warrior has a great
tactical mind and can often find the best positions for his warriors to meet
the oncoming attack. In any scenario the warband leader may reposition his
warriors after his opponent has set up and may even advance them up to 12
inch onto the board instead of 8 inch.

That's vague enough as it is, but what if both players in a game have this
skill? Player one deploys, then player two... then player one
re-deploys, and player two also re-deploys? When does it end? Once
each? Or do the skills just cancel out and neither re-deploys?

Thanks in advance for any help! This is liable to come up in my next game...

roll a dice simple.

As the same of ... same Attack First , same Iniziative ... then roll a dice to decide

As I've said before we just got fed up with it and agreed to stop using it. We don't argue about striking first, but boy howdy, as written that skill is pure shoutin' match.

You lot seem to be able to hash things out so come up with a solution and house rule it.

The solution seems simple to me, if both people have it they just cancel each other out. of course you can have the first player set up the second sets up, the first re-arranges, the second re-arranges. I think that just canceling out works out best tho.

Both players roll? Highest gets to redeploy that battle, representing the leader tactically outwitting the other?

Seems like a simple enough option as has been said

Added to the FAQ. Answer pending.

Thanks for all the comments! I think I'll suggest to my also-tactician-ing opponent that the skills cancel out.

Von Kurst wrote:

As I've said before we just got fed up with it and agreed to stop using
it. We don't argue about striking first, but boy howdy, as written that
skill is pure shoutin' match.

I really like the idea of the skill though. Still, I had decided not to use it... but then the skaven player selected it, and I thought I might as well.

cianty wrote:

Added to the FAQ. Answer pending.

I don't know which FAQ that is, but thank you!

Experience of the captain would another good way to chose wich ... then if its the same roll a die

meerkat wrote:

cianty wrote:

Added to the FAQ. Answer pending.

I don't know which FAQ that is, but thank you!

The upcoming official FAQ. See here.

Thanks!

And look, there's an answer there:

Quote :

You would roll off for who would go first with the Tactician skill.
Basically, you need to decide if the highest roll goes first or can
choose to go 2nd. We will add to our growing list.

Though, I'm not sure I quite understand what that means.

It will be properly worded eventually.

@Meerkat

What it means that a D6 should decide who goes first. With that it has not been defined if the person with the highest D6 must go first or choose to let the other person go. That is why it is noted to add to the list as the total answered is not finalized.

With that, if offers gamers now a chance to play it fairly by agreeing on something without waiting for official word as I would like to discuss with my other Rules Gurus.

Honestly if something like this causes a problem, you arnt playing mordheim for the right reason. Roll a dice, highest person always gets to choose who makes the move in every aspect of GWhammers, so play it like that. problem solved-o

@Mr Bretonnia...I totally agree with you but there are those out there that will challenge it all unless it is in black and white.

"O thread of Tactician, I resurrect thee!"

Our group spent about an hour discussing whether to throw Tactician out, and if not, how to modify it to keep it in our games. Playtesting over two campaigns has definitely shown this skill to kill the enjoyment of certain scenarios which absolutely depend upon a certain starting distance from scenario objectives.

Understandably, our most vocal Dwarf aficionado was adamant (or is that gromrilant?) about keeping it in.

I, the Keeper of the Rules, was just as vocal about not having to keep track of which scenarios in which we'd not allow it to be used. That just makes my skin of consistency crawl.

I suggested the two following ideas, both of which were shot down:
1. Allow resetting of models, but take away the extra 4" deployment zone expansion - of course, Mr. Dwarf was very loathe to go with losing that extra distance.
2. Reword the skill so that the die roll for "who sets up first" would be either modified or re-rolled.

We all agreed that the issue really comes in when multiple players get to use the benefits of Tactician. The conversation also went through a long talk about how the better leaders should be able to take better advantage of the skill.

Here's what we settled on:

Tactician. During Scenario Setup, each player with Tactician tests Leadership with his Captain. If at least one player is successful, the single player who rolled the furthest under his Captain's Leadership can, after all initial warband deployment, reset his models in a deployment zone expanded by 4" from the original zone.

I know this could be worded more clearly, which is something we'll work on. We're going to playtest it through our next campaign (early 2010).

That's an interesting solution.

wyldhunt wrote:

Understandably, our most vocal Dwarf aficionado was adamant (or is that gromrilant?) about keeping it in.

But dwarfs can't take academic skills, surely.

meerkat wrote:

That's an interesting solution.

wyldhunt wrote:

Understandably, our most vocal Dwarf aficionado was adamant (or is that gromrilant?) about keeping it in.

But dwarfs can't take academic skills, surely.

Huh, your right, no academics for Dwarves, makes sense with their 'no magic' attitude for one.

It's true that Dwarf Treasure Hunters can't take Academic, however, the Nemesis Crown's Dwarf Rangers allows such, and while Dwarfs don't like spellcasting, they still like magic (such as Runes) plenty. I can see the design decision not to allow Dwarf Treasure Hunters access to the Wyrdstone Hunter skill, however they could still get Wyrdstone Pendulums for the same effect, so that's not really restrictive. I am definitely of the opinion that if anyone can get Tactician, a Dwarf Noble should be able to. For all of these reasons, we have allowed Academic skills to the Dwarf Treasure Hunter Noble.