Beastmen: Starting group and final group plans?

Hi,

I'm going to start a beastmen warband and actually I'm not quite sure what miniatures to get not buying anything not useful.

My starting warband consists of

1x Chieftain
1x Shaman
2x Bestigors
3x Ungors
1x Gor
2x Warhounds


After onle playgame I would think of following list consisting of 15 models:


Beastmen Chief
Shaman
2x Bestigor
Centigor
Minotaur
3x Warhounds
5x Gors
1x Ungor


Five heroes is clear, also the minotaur. I'm really going to get one, I'm only not sure which model.

Though I'm not quite sure how good the warhounds really are: They are cheap and very fast. And because my Centigor can't climb, I need some fast companions at the ground. (Is the minotaur even able to climb ladders?).

I really like the Ungor models. But I really think +1 WS and +1 T (!) are the way to go. So i chose gors over ungors. Eventually one of my Gors is going to become a hero, so I don't need any ungors.

Don't get my wrong, ungors are pretty cool. But even if my group allows me to buy shortbows, I don't think I'm really going to kill somethin with it. BS3, moved and long distance. Ain't going to hit something with this. Especially against the human longbows. (I'm playing against some mercenaries, skaven, the others aren't sure yet).


So I'm thinking about getting:

GW Bestigors
GW Gors
GW Shaman
GW Wargs (the new made for the Hobbit)
Minotaur (not sure, which model to get. Eventually a big satyr by coolminiornot or Brunchaat of maelstrom/banelords or by enigma. There are a lot of great options).

Eventually I'm getting the army set. Then I have got Ungors for the start and lots of options. I'm trying to build the Beastlord out of it, also the centigor (Thinking about a barbarian chaos rider horse with a gor body).


Best regards,
Seikilos

Very unlikely that you are going to have the money to buy a minotaur after game one if you didn't start with it already (let alone the centigor and 5 gors).
The powergamer's approach would probably be to get all heroes possible, two hounds, and as many gors and clubs as possible. If you want a minotaur, you should get it right away, because you wount have the money until late in a campaign (when the mino is not that powerful anymore).
Modelwise, it's probably enough to get a box of bestigors or gors/ungors to build all heroes and gors (and ungors if you must). The barbarian-horses are too big for the gor-torsi to build a centigor with. You could just take one from GW, I like those. Since you don't need six hounds, buying the Düsterwarge-box for 25€ might be a little bit of a waste, except if you really really really like the models.
There are tons of great minotaur-models out there, each one way better than the GW-box (which is 37€ for 3 and you only need one) in my opinion. I suggest to take a look at battlefield berlin and use their search-option.
http://www.shop.battlefield-berlin.de
If you want two really cool models for your chieftain and shaman, I can suggest the Tiersippe Keiler and Satyr from the new german company RuneCast. Unfortunately, you only get them on pk-pro so far:
http://www.pk-pro.de/index.php?k=394

Thank you for your answer!

I don't want to get a minotaur after game one... But I want it, as soon i can afford it. As I read, it wouldn't be too good to start with a minotaur, but I hope to get it pretty soon.

I don't like the powergamrs approach. I want at least a little fluff and the idea getting a minotaur ;-)

The centigor models are not THAT bad, but have one (in my opionion) serious problem: They have no hooves   

I looked a lot at the battlefield-shop. But the wargs are the only models, I really like. There are some others, too, but then they would look each very different, I don't know if i would like that. I think reaper had some great models (wolves, hyenas and so on), but they don't fit as much as the wargs would do.

The Tiersippe Keiler (warum versuch ich mir eigentlich hier alles krampfhaft auf Englisch aus dem Hirn zu saugen?!) looks pretty cool, but fits optically not really in the rest of the army. Especially after I really like all the Gor/Ungor/Shaman/Chieftain models games workshop has published.

A friend of mine really has many miniatures and builts diorames (actual english word?). He would take the rest of my army box and Düsterwarge, if I don't need them!

Quote :

Though I'm not quite sure how good the warhounds really are: They are cheap and very fast. And because my Centigor can't climb, I need some fast companions at the ground. (Is the minotaur even able to climb ladders?).

Yes the Minotaur may climb.

Quote :

I really like the Ungor models. But I really think +1 WS and +1 T (!) are the way to go. So i chose gors over ungors. Eventually one of my Gors is going to become a hero, so I don't need any ungors.

Then don't start with 3.  Start with more Gors or the Minotaur.  Minotaurs are hell on wheels in the early game.
If you are going to leave the Minotaur until you can afford one, I would recommend starting with all 5 heroes.  Heroes=money in Mordheim.

Quote :

Don't get my wrong, ungors are pretty cool. But even if my group allows me to buy shortbows, I don't think I'm really going to kill somethin with it. BS3, moved and long distance. Ain't going to hit something with this. Especially against the human longbows. (I'm playing against some mercenaries, skaven, the others aren't sure yet).

Little story--a few years ago we had two Beastmen warbands in a Mordheim campaign.  One went with ungors with short bows and one went with hounds.  At the end of the campaign the ungor with short bows player was saying that his ungors did nothing.  I had to disagree since I lost a Witch Hunter hero to one of his ungor's arrows.     No big deal to him, big deal to me.

Once they are in range, your henchmen can shoot as well as their henchmen [unless they are Reiklanders].  Just use cover and give yourself a chance.  Some shooting is often better than no shooting, especially if the shooters are mobile. If nothing else, you discourage them from standing in the open and pot shooting away at you.

Quote :

diorames

Diorama is an English word.

Quote :

a model representing a scene with three-dimensional figures, either in miniature or as a large-scale museum exhibit.

You also use Diorama in german and I guess Seikilos was asking if it's right to use it in english as well (btw I guess it's a latin word or something   )
@Seikilos. I'm surprised you couln't find a useful Minotaur on BattlefieldBerlin, I like quite a few they have. About the Centigors: there used to be a named Character called Thunderhoof or something that I cannot find on the GW-HP anymore. According to his name he should have hoofes, so maybe you can find him on ebay. Here is a pic of mine that both shows that barbarian-horses are more on the tall sinde but that the old GW-horses work well for Gor-Torsi:

And about talking english here: I totally like the international flair this forum has (though you are invited to try out tabletopwelt next week as well of course   )

Edit: here is a thread with nice centigor-conversions:
http://z8.invisionfree.com/herdstone/index.php?showtopic=18290

Hi,

thanks again.

I'm going to write some lists today and post it here (or in a separate thread). My starting list for my first testgame was in my first post.

If I'm going to get 5 heroes OR the minotaur at the start, I wouldn't know what else to cut. I would think, then there were to little miniatures on the battlefield?

If I'm going to use the minotaur, I would cut the warhounds. So I would have a warband ALL able to climb ladders and I wouldn't have to split my army at anytime. But for a 200 gc minotaurs I would have to cut a lot more.

Second option would starting with 5 heroes, where I don't have any gc left for gors or ungors, since I wouldn't be able to cut the warhounds.

Third option would be 3-4 heroes and the ungors with shortbows.


I'm going to write some lists and post it for discussion. I have to think about all the information I got here!


Thanks again!

Blimey, there are still beastmen on the loose around Mordheim. Last I heard was that goblins were using their smelly carcasses for troll bait!

I thought we'd routed all the stinking beasts!

Nice to hear you might be working on a centauroid conversion. They're my favourite mutants.

So I wrote a total of four lists with pros and cons. Please comment and help me get the best warband ;-)



Warband 1: Allrounder

1x Chief, light Armor, Helmet, Sword, Club (108)
1x Shaman, Sword/dagger (55)
1x Bestigor, Club, Sword, Helmet (68)
1x Bestigor, Two-Handed-Weapon, Helmet (70)
2x Gor, 2x Club (84)
3x Ungor, Club/Dagger (84)
2x Warhound (30)

Adds to a total of 499 gc.

Pros are:
+ allround
+ 11 models

Cons are:
- Not all models can climb ladders
- No ranged attacks
- No minotaur
- Models with T3 in game





Warband 2: 1 Minotaur to rule them all:


1x Chief, light Armor, Helmet, Sword, Club (108)
1x Shaman (45)
2x Bestigor, Club, Sword, Helmet (2x 68= 136)
1x Minotaur, Halberd (210)


Adds to a total of 499 gc.

Pros are:
+ Minotaur!
+ all models can climb

Cons are:
- only 5 (!) models
- only 5 (!) models ;-)
- no henchmen except for the minotaur!




Warband 3: 5 Heroes:


1x Chief, light Armor, Helmet, Sword, Club (108)
1x Shaman, dagger (45)
2x Bestigor, 2x Club, Helmet (2x 61 = 122)
1x Centigor, 2x Club, Helmet (96)
3x Warhound (45)
2x Gor, 2x Club (2x 42= 84)

Adds to a total of 500 gc.

Pros are:
+ pretty fast because of centigor and three warhounds
+ 5 heroes!

Cons are:
- not all models can climb ladders!
- only 9 models
- not much to sacrifice except for warhounds



Warband 4: Ungors with shortbows


1x Chief, light Armor, Helmet, Sword, Club (108)
1x Shaman, Club/dagger (48)
1x Bestigor, 2x Club, Helmet (61)
1x Bestigor, 2x Club (51)
5x Ungor, Short Bow / Dagger (5x 30 = 150)
2x Gor, 2x Club (2x41 = 82)

Adds to a total of 500 gc.

Pros are:

+ 11 models
+ ranged weapons
+ complete warband can climb ladders

Cons are:

- nothing in front to sacrifice due Ungors stay behind
- officially not possible
- no minotaur





Perhaps you can help me making this lists better?
If I had to play one of these four lists, I probably would play list 1 or 4. List two has the minotaur but far too less models at all. And if the minotaur dies, I can quit playing the campaign.

The five heroes list is pretty cool, I think. But i really think it would be a huge advantage if all my warband can climb ladders. My enemy is really scared of the movement of the warhounds, but if he can see him, he is shot pretty soon.


What do YOU think of these lists?


Thanks!

If you're looking for a grim Centigor, check out Ghorros Warhoof. Apparantly he's no longer avaliable on GWs website, but you should be able to get him for around 12 - 13 pounds elsewhere. Just be aware that his arm might fall off a couple of times, so make sure you glue it well.

If you want a cheap Minotaur check this Minotaur out.

My suggestion would be not to go for any Ungors before you have 6 Heroes. You need that Lad's, since Beastmen don't have much use for Tarot Cards nor Wyrdstone Pendulums and those Master Maps can be hard to get your hands on.

Also, I'd really start with 5 Heroes. If it's a campaign I'd go for 2 Gors and 2 Warhounds, if it's 'just for fun games' I'd take 3 Gors. Equip your Heroes well, sacrifice the warhounds if you must or else just rip it all apart.

If you really want to start with the Minotaur, skip the Light Armour on your Chief and get a Warhound instead.

Wyrdstone Pendulum is excellent. Not such a fan of tarot readings but hey.

Hi,

if getting a minotaur, I'm not sure if to get this Enigma Minotaur or this from Darklands.

I'm not quite sure where to get a good Centigor. Perhaps I need someone to greenstuff it for me out of a actual centigor (hoovess!) or made of a gor/ungor and a horse. My GS Skills are limited in filling gaps.

It's going to be the start of a campaign. We're not really powergamers, so I don't really get everything out of it. Though winning would be my favourite ;-)

I'm going to write a new list later. What do you mean with "equip your heroes well"? Aren't they well equipped?

If REALLY getting 5 heroes, don't I have to get any warhounds? Or do I have to run with a single Centigor-hero all alone on the battlefield?

So here's another list. It contains 5 heroes and gors:

1x Chieftain, light Armor, Helmet, Sword, Club (108)
1x Shaman, Sword (55)
2x Bestigor, 2x Club (102)
1x Centigor, light Armor, Helmet, Shield, 2x Club (121)
2x Warhound (30)
2x Gor, 2x Club (82)


Adds to a total of 498 gc.

Pros:

+ 5 heroes
+ pretty fast (especially the cavalry)

Cons:

- normally I will have to split the army, because Centigor and Warhounds cannot climb ladders
- only 9 models
- heroes not really well equipped (especially defense)




What you think about it?

The third and fifth are certainly the most competitive. Maybe in your fifth list you could leave the light armor and helmets behind and replace the swords for clubs to get a third gor in. I also like the fourth list, it is the most all around and you could still sacrifice two ungors if necessary.

Hi,

thanks for your opinion.

The swords, light armor and helmets are the only things left to protect my heroes. I think especially the Centigor is going to be shot all the time.

I bought now the following:

1x Morghur (going to cut the tree away and get it on an 25 mm base as shaman)
1x Box of gors (out of which I'm going ot build gors, Bestigors and my chieftain)
1x Box of Düsterwarge (what would that be in English ;-))
1x Centigor (I bough this model. It has hooves and is unique. I'm only going to replace the head. And paint it new, of course ;-)).

Unfortunately in most german online-shops the ungor-box isn't available. So i couldn't buy it, which means, probably I won't play any Ungors at the beginning. Same with the minotaur.


So I think, I make another test-game with list 2 (Minotaur) and going to start the campaign with list 5.


I'm still glad about further tipps, hints and opinions, though!

Nice find for the Centigor, that's a Confrontation-mini, right? The Düsterwarge are Fell Wargs btw.

I don't even know, wheres that minature from. I hope, my (GS) Skills will be good enough to give him a new head, perhaps a shield and a new weaopn ;-)

But the body and the hoove really are great.


As long the next game will be a test game, perhaps I'm gonna try following list (for fun and to derange my oppontents):

1x Chieftain, Sword, Club, Shield, heavy armor, Helmet (143)
1x Minotaur, Sword, Shield, heavy armor, Helmet (275)
1x Bestigor, 2x Club, light armor, helmet (81)

But I think that's kind of an extreme list, and I'm not sure, if it would be any fun to play (against).

But if we really play a testgame first, I'm gonna test the minotaur absolutely.

Perhaps with the following list:

1x Chief, light Armor, Sword, Club, Shield (103)
1x Minotaur, Halberd (210)
2x Bestigor, 2x Club (102)
2x Gor, 2x Club (82)

Cheap minotaur.

http://www.reapermini.com/Miniatures/Bones/latest/77013

Hi,

thanks again.

But the minotaur really doesn’t have to be cheap. It has be a incredibly good looking model ;-)

I think, if I hade to decide right now, I would buy this one, second choice would be this one.

So at the moment I assembled six chaoshound, of which three are almost painted. And I assembled 5 gors I’m going to play as two gors, two bestigors and my chieftain. The Chieftain has the most horns and the greatest weapons, the bestigors have metal in their face and the gors have the weapons low. I hope, on the battlefield all can spot the differences.

Unfortunately the gor-box had too little clubs, maces or something like that. And because I havn’t got any bits left, I had to give them swords, axes and daggers though they aren’t equipped that way. Do you all play only WYSIWYG or would that be okay?

Axes can be sculpted into clubs without too much effort.

I have assembled a few beastman warbands and there were plenty of clubs and things that could be made into clubs, as I recall.

Another thing you can do is chop off the swords and replace them with shafts from the standard and add mace/club heads. Even if you have to make the heads from scratch it is not too hard to make a sphere of greenstuff and put spikes on it. Or a couple of dagger blades or spear heads or whatever else pointy you have lying around in your bits box.

By gor box, I assume you mean these guys? http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440031a&prodId=prod460007a

I would say, buy the box of 3 mintours and keep them. Give each model different weapons so during your games you can 'upgrade' your mintour's weapons. Same thing with the goes or ungors etc. Allows you have more options for your models on what weapons they can use.

Oh.... I kinda like those minotaurs and the beastman chieftain is awesome !!

http://www.avatars-of-war.com/eng/web/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=83&Itemid=118

Hi,

I have to gors box already...

I built 1 Chieftain, 2 Bestigors and going to build another 5 Gors. 1 head is for my centigor, so I havnT got that much left to upgrade.

Going to buy some ungors two, building 5 with bows and 5 with hand weapons.

The minotaurs are pretty cool, but I dont think the Chieftain fits in well.

I really, really really dont like the citadel minotaurs. They really not good. And they dont have hooves... absolute no-go!

One of my friends just made a beastmen warband, building his starting warband out of just the Gor box.
It has a lot of cool bits and I really like the sculpts. His starting warband was Chieftain, Shaman, Bestigor, Bestigor and minotaur (Currently in the shape of a rat-ogre till he gets a suitable model ).

It was a risky start and he did lose, but rolling Survived against the Odds and also beating a pit fighter on the injury rolls it's definately viable to go greedy from the start!

Seikilos wrote:

I really, really really dont like the citadel minotaurs. They really not good. And they dont have hooves... absolute no-go!

Why have I never noticed that?!  

Can't stop looking at those feet! Darn, they're ugly! Thanks for the heads up in case I should've ever considered buying those  

Hi,

after two games my warband looks like this:


Chieftain Kal-Torak. Light armor, helmet, sword, club, shield, 23 exp
Shaman Soltar. Sword. -1 M (leg wound), 14 exp
Bestigor Drog-Tarr. 2x Club, shield, immune to fear, 10 exp
Bestigor Vargo, 2x club, shield, helmet, WS 5, 11 exp
Centigor Angarak, light armore, helmet, shield, club. Only one arm left, 10 exp
Gor Gor-Natak, 2x club, 2 exp
Gor Murgos, 2x club, 2 exp
Gor Thoros, 2x club, 1 exp
Gor Thoros, 2x club, 0 exp
Gor Malgor, 2x club, 0 exp
Warhound Zerfetzer
Warhound Zerfleischer



What do you think how to go on?

I don't really want to get any ungors. They have only T3 and can't get really THAT good. Thinking about just replacing eventually dying Gors and saving up for a minotaur with halberd, heavy armor, helmet, shield...

Or just adding three more warhounds?