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 Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?

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Mortimer
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PostSubject: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sat 31 Oct 2009 - 12:26

Somewhat inspired by the Zealot usefulness thread, I was wondering if Zombies would become more useful if you allowed them to take some equipment (They used to back in the heydays of Warhammer).

Perhaps

Zombie Equipment List

Mace .............................. 3 gc
Hammer ........................... 3 gc
Axe ................................. 5 gc
Double-handed Weapon ..... 15 gc
Halberd ............................ 5 gc

Shield .............................. 5 gc
Light Armour .................... 20 gc

I was thinking that or replacing them with skeletons, who could have bows and spears perhaps.

M WS BS S T W I A Ld
4 2 2 3 3 1 2 1 5
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pistolpete308
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sat 31 Oct 2009 - 17:30

The problem is not merely that zombies can't have weapons. There are actually a several problems with the henchmen list for undead warbands.

A) None of the henchmen may use equipment.

B) Only ghouls gain experience.

C) Wolves and Zombies rapidly lose thier usefulness as every other warband gains experience.

D) None of the henchmen can shoot.

The best solution to this problem that I've seen was a list that included henchman level Dregs.
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Asp
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sat 31 Oct 2009 - 23:37

1 make zombies able to run

2 include henchman dregs
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ObsidianLord
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 3:30

I think zombies are good as they are.
Don't let them run (none of the undead can't do it).
Don't let them able to wear equipment (they're not warriors but mindless minions).
Don't forget they are immune to pain and may cause fear!

Making GHOULS able to wear equipment makes more sense to me.
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 3:41

Quote :
Don't let them run (none of the undead can't do it).

vampire
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AFKzombie
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 4:08

i think he meant MOST undead can't do it (and a vampire is certainly not your run of the mill undead). also zombies don't need fixing, they cause fear, immune to psych, immune to poison, no pain, and their cheap (not to mention every exploration roll an undead warband makes is like heres some GC and LOL free zombies). not only that but when your necomancer gains the re-animation spell your bringing these little suckers back to life. as for ghouls, equipment would be nice, but they already start off with A2 and with the way people have been posting that armor is useless they don't need it with T4, and also when those skill rolls start coming down S4 A3 I4 ghouls are stupid awsome. WS3 isn't bad, but please god not LD 6 >.> and then if you can get a ghoul hero, well F that noise. i have a ghoul hero in my league and he's A4 step-side, mighty blow, and resil (of course the poor thing has a leg injury and nervous condition =X) but when he gets there he wins.
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 4:12

heh

Quote :
when your necomancer gains the re-animation spell your bringing these little suckers back to life.

true. that spell is too good, actually

but still, vanilla zombies are not worth it.
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 4:15

nou
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 4:42

?
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wyldhunt
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 5:53

I do agree that vanilla zombies aren't worth it, but chocolate-chip zombies just might be...

Anyway, the base issue with zombies themselves that I've seen is their mobility. I've tried the Ghouls + Dire Wolves route instead, and its working very, very well. Even so, I can't see allowing Zombies to run - it just breaks too much GW fluff. Perhaps an adjustment to Call of Vanhel might be in order, to make it Zombies only (Dire Wolves don't need this extra move), and affect 1D6 Zombies.

A base issue with playing Undead is definitely lack of missile firepower combined with lack of manueverability (at least the Beastmen warband has manueverability). Get Dire Wolves, and you solve one part of that - yeah, they're expensive, but not that much more than a 25gc warior with 10gc bow and 3gc mace.

I also like what some have done and added Skeletons to the list for more missile availability, but at BS2 which never increases, this really doesn't help much.
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Horatio
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 5:56

Some fantasy settings describe the practice of retrofitting the undead: plating them with armor, reinforcing limbs, or casting activate-on-touch on them and such like. Maybe some alternate leveling system could be devised for a skeleton type unit?
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Von Kurst
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 7:44

After 6 months of playing with Styro's Sartosa I like the idea of an undead warband that can raise fallen/captured enemy henchmen on a 4+ or so. Much more fluffy, My other house rule would be that instead of reverting to zombie stats they just become -1 WS/BS and -2 I and Ld.

Skeletons in the Necrarch and Tomb Guardian warband suffer from the same can't get experience problem even with bows and spears (although they suck less than zombies.)

All that said the Undead warband is a powerhouse as long as the Vamp is kicking.

@pistolpete welcome aboard mate!
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Sun 1 Nov 2009 - 8:00

I must say I like the fact that Undead are quite different than many other warbands.

explain: "vanilla Zombies"
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PostSubject: Re: Arming the Dead: More useful zombies?   Today at 8:17

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