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 Pit Figher Way Too Good?

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2704ENG
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PostSubject: Pit Figher Way Too Good?   Sun 17 Jul 2016 - 23:30

For 30gc and 15gc upkeep this guy is ridiculous!

Comes with morning star, spiked gauntlet and helmet equipment cost along on the morning star and helmet costs 25gc!

In addition he gets S4, T4, and I4. In the first round of combat the guy gets 2xS5 attacks and 1xS4 attack - that's nuts especially for the early stages of the campaign.

Compare him to my Orc Mob Boss who costs 85gc (110gc if equipped the same way) has one less Initiative and Attack, but one more BS and Ld and cost three times as much. Okay so there is the upkeep fee to keep in mind but 15gc is pocket change.

Perhaps a increased hiring and upkeep cost of 50gc and 25gc respectively would be more reflective of his abilities.

Thoughts?

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PostSubject: Re: Pit Figher Way Too Good?   Mon 18 Jul 2016 - 0:26

Well my marauder warband got an 'imperial' assassin (read Death cult worshiping Khorne) upkeep of 20 gc. It manageable but if you want to hire more they upkeep is added together.
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PostSubject: Re: Pit Figher Way Too Good?   Mon 18 Jul 2016 - 4:30

I think it's great, one of the "wave one" no brainer choices alongside the halfling and the tilean marksman. Sometimes I even hire him from the begging with my starting warband, depending wich band I'm running. But I think he isn't overpowered for his cost, 50gc and 25gc unkeep seems way too much, he would become a "wave two" choice and I'd rather prefer a much better supporting assassin or an ogre meatshield then. Pitfighter is great from the beggining, and may become a beast with 2 or 3 advances, but he's a hechmen and can't add more than 1 to his initial stats (starts with maximun S and T, so no advances there) and is pretty limited earning exp compared to heroes. If you hire him from the start, he starts to fall behind heroes after 4 or 5 games, when his unkeep bring his cumulated price to 90-105gc (that's vampire/possessed price range). If you hire him at that moment of the campaign, he's still great for 30gc, but not so powerful compared to the biggest threats on the table.

Pit fighter is powerful when he charges and he's supported by other guys (he's even good all alone against multiple weaklings), but with one wound and no special rules he's vulnerable to charges and ranged... and this guy is a crossbow fire magnet. I think you may see him as overpowered for that reason, as I recall from past messages your group doesn't use ranged at all.

Think about measure/counter-measure to balance the game with tactics rather than houseruling what isn't broken. Your rival hires a powerful close combat guy with no ranged at all, feel free to hire a good marksmen and place him in exposed on a great spot to take that guy down and threaten the whole band as the enemy has no way to counter attack him. Then your rival should hire another good marksmen as counter-measure or make a runner hero to take him down... and it goes on and on like that.

I think you have a great example here in this Reikland vs Withc Hunters BatRep. How Reikland crossbows win the game by delaying the most dangerous foes, the Flagellants. Only one of them was taken OOA, but the most important thing is crossbows made the most dangerous foes irrelevant during the game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhfKJ_teRDU

Sorry for the long post... vacation you know haha.
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PostSubject: Re: Pit Figher Way Too Good?   Mon 18 Jul 2016 - 7:50

bitxo wrote:
I think it's great, one of the "wave one" no brainer choices alongside the halfling and the tilean marksman. Sometimes I even hire him from the begging with my starting warband, depending wich band I'm running. But I think he isn't overpowered for his cost, 50gc and 25gc unkeep seems way too much, he would become a "wave two" choice and I'd rather prefer a much better supporting assassin or an ogre meatshield then. Pitfighter is great from the beggining, and may become a beast with 2 or 3 advances, but he's a hechmen and can't add more than 1 to his initial stats (starts with maximun S and T, so no advances there) and is pretty limited earning exp compared to heroes. If you hire him from the start, he starts to fall behind heroes after 4 or 5 games, when his unkeep bring his cumulated price to 90-105gc (that's vampire/possessed price range). If you hire him at that moment of the campaign, he's still great for 30gc, but not so powerful compared to the biggest threats on the table.

Pit fighter is powerful when he charges and he's supported by other guys (he's even good all alone against multiple weaklings), but with one wound and no special rules he's vulnerable to charges and ranged... and this guy is a crossbow fire magnet. I think you may see him as overpowered for that reason, as I recall from past messages your group doesn't use ranged at all.

Think about measure/counter-measure to balance the game with tactics rather than houseruling what isn't broken. Your rival hires a powerful close combat guy with no ranged at all, feel free to hire a good marksmen and place him in exposed on a great spot to take that guy down and threaten the whole band as the enemy has no way to counter attack him. Then your rival should hire another good marksmen as counter-measure or make a runner hero to take him down... and it goes on and on like that.

I think you have a great example here in this Reikland vs Withc Hunters BatRep. How Reikland crossbows win the game by delaying the most dangerous foes, the Flagellants. Only one of them was taken OOA, but the most important thing is crossbows made the most dangerous foes irrelevant during the game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhfKJ_teRDU

Sorry for the long post... vacation you know haha.

Yep very good observations in terms of Pit Fighter scaling. Still he is as scary as hell when starting off even if he is a arrow magnet - but definitely a must buy.

For our new campaign my mate will be trading in his Possessed for the Witch Hunters. I showed him the Rabble Rousing rules that was posted here earlier and he really liked it so we'll see how that works out.
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PostSubject: Re: Pit Figher Way Too Good?   Sat 23 Jul 2016 - 8:49

Quote :
Think about measure/counter-measure to balance the game with tactics rather than houseruling what isn't broken.

+1 to this. The Pit Fighter will work for orcs and won't work for undead. Think of him as a less expensive troll and enjoy.
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PostSubject: Re: Pit Figher Way Too Good?   Today at 6:15

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