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 Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)

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FireKnife
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PostSubject: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Thu 5 Mar 2015 - 8:50

Ok, this is more a 'what difference does it make' rather than anything else.

Now a Spiked Gauntlet is classed as an additional hand weapon and a Buckler in one. Now forgive me but isn't that a sword for all intents and purposes? Both offer an extra attack, both offer the option no Parry and that's about it.

Is there a price difference I am not seeing or is the inclusion of the 'and no, your Heroes cannot learn how to use it' a bit redundant? :p

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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Thu 5 Mar 2015 - 9:42

Hahaha I never saw it like that, yes you seem to be correct.
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Thu 5 Mar 2015 - 10:01

I think its more that the Pit Fighter uses a Morning Star in his main hand which prevents the use of a second weapon or buckler with it.
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Thu 5 Mar 2015 - 13:30

We made a house rule that bucklers could parry on even results to hit, and anything that counts as a buckler making both spiked gauntlets and bucklers more useful
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Thu 5 Mar 2015 - 13:55

Yep, Mike hit on the difference. You can't use a sword with a morning star, but you CAN use a buckler. Which means you can use the spiked gauntlet with a morning star because it counts as a buckler.
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Thu 5 Mar 2015 - 17:01

Almost. You cannot use a second weapon or a buckler with a morning star, but you may use a shield. The spiked gauntlet is special to the Pit Fighter Hired Sword and the Pit Fighter Warband. Unless you house rule to allow a non pit fighter warband to come across a spiked gauntlet somehow and then allow its use with perhaps the Weapons Training Skill.
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Fri 6 Mar 2015 - 7:48

...huh. Looked it up and right you are Mike. Which means that per rules as written there is nothing that actually lets the Pit Fighter use both the spiked guantlet and the morning star at the same time. So it is functionally identical to a sword, except that it can be combined with a swrod for a re-roll to parry. Except that without the pit fighter warband (aka, the state of things when it was originally written) it can only be taken by the pit fighter hired sword, who can't get a sword. Suspect
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Mon 9 Mar 2015 - 5:43

So original rules as they are makes it a bit 'meh' then due to the Morning Star only allowing a shield to go with it?

Ah well, looks like I will look to a different Hired Sword to join my merry band.

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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Mon 9 Mar 2015 - 12:22

The Pit Fighter hired sword special rule of using a morning star and spiked gauntlet as well as his WS, S and T of 4 make him a pretty decent addition. He has always performed well in our campaigns and is always in the Middenheimers front line bashing away. Going to have to model a dwarf version for my warband. Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Mon 9 Mar 2015 - 18:52

Mike wrote:
The Pit Fighter hired sword special rule of using a morning star and spiked gauntlet as well as his WS, S and T of 4 make him a pretty decent addition.

I hadn't noticed that the Pit Fighter HS had a special rule for using a morning star and a spiked gauntlet.
We have had a house rule that he could, which makes the HS pretty useful.
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Tue 10 Mar 2015 - 0:05

Special rule as in the entry for this HS states he has a morning star and spiked gauntlet. The way the HS is written contravenes the normal weapons rules. Not sure why it would need a house rule in this instance.
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Tue 10 Mar 2015 - 5:33

I just see it as 'comes with a....' but it doesn't say he can use both at the same time.

Bit like giving someone a buckler and a double handed weapon, you can, it just means they have to pick which one to use in combat.

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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Tue 10 Mar 2015 - 12:39

Yeah, just having both weapons doesn't grant any additional rules about using both, so as written the pit fighter must choose. I'd guess that most groups either didn't realize the contradiction (like mine) or have house-ruled it (like Von Kurst's)
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Tue 10 Mar 2015 - 13:37

Well I am surprised that anyone interprets the Pit Fighter that way but that's the beauty of the malleability of Mordheim. If so the spiked gauntlet is just a name for a sword, it could be a spatula for all intents and purposes. We like the HS as written and sculpted dual wielding. Keep gaming! Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Wed 11 Mar 2015 - 3:39

Personally I wouldn't mind the Pit Fighter using both but as I have found every group I play with seems to have a 50/50 split on such rules.

Some are just people trying to swing a little advantage there way, intentionally 'misinterpreting' the rules but they are quickly told. However there are splits like this were some go with RAI and others with RAW. For me this one feels like it was meant to be both otherwise it is redundant both for him to have it and for it to be restricted to the Pit Fighter.

Oh well, likely to go for an Assassin or something else Smile.

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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Wed 11 Mar 2015 - 5:20

I agree that it would seem that RAI would be for the Spiked Gauntlet to be used with th Morning Star. Interesting though that RAW this is not actually allowed. I don't have an issue with RAI being used as a house rule.

After all, he wields the morning star in one hand and and has the spiked gauntlet is strapped to his friggen other arm!! It is obvious that this pit fighter is buffed enough that he doesn't need two hands to wield the 'heavy' morning star. The picture in the rulebook even has him posing to show off his muscles. Wink
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PostSubject: Re: Spiked Gauntlet (Pit Fighter)    Today at 13:03

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