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 wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)

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wamez
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PostSubject: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Fri 3 Oct 2008 - 18:03

OK. I've been out of the gaming scene for a while. But having just entered the Golden Tom, I decided to take the opportunity to photograph some other stuff I'm working on.

BTW, sorry about the choice of rooms. Our bedroom gets the best light and my camera does not, in any way, rock.

So first up is a cottage based on a plan from WD (made a long, long time ago):



Next is a slightly more recent (but still a long time ago) watchtower that I just came up with:



Finally, I started working on my first official Mordheim building -- a Ruined Sigmarren (?) Cathedral. As an experiment, I wanted to try doing gothic on the cheap (ie no bought pre-molded pieces). Unfortunately, what you save in money goes out the window in time. Trying to cut layer upon layer of overlapping cardboard for all the "carved stone" detail is, um, painstaking. And doesn't always work out the way you think.

AND I'm not totally sure this is going to work out the way I plan anyway. I'm hoping a good dose of drybrushing will bring out the details. But I have no idea...





I was also inspired by that amazing table by Wolfgang(?) that was posted a while ago. It had a chapel with a graveyard that was removable so that you could play in the catacombs under the graveyard (now that I think about it, that might not be a great idea if you dig the grave too deep -- the body just falls right through the catacomb ceiling!).

I wanted the same thing, so I built my cathedral structure on a base, made it removable, and then designed a simple floorplan for the crypt below.



That's it for now. I'm working on roof tiling which always takes time because I do each tile individually for a nice weathered look. And I have a lot of detail work to do to the walls. Ack, more cardboard cutting. The cost of X-acto blades alone may make this more expensive than just buying a pre-fabbed ruined building. Oh well.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Fri 3 Oct 2008 - 20:48

I don't know what else to say other then SHEER AWESOMENESS!

I love that Cathedral - unbelievable. That is just amazing.

Thanks for showing it.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Fri 3 Oct 2008 - 22:29

WoW! Excellent buildings. I would love to get to run my warband through that huge cathedral!
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Fri 3 Oct 2008 - 22:43

Wow! That is absolutely fabulous! Great work.

Your original buildings, although not very playable, are beautifully created, and don't take up too much space on your board. thumbsup They're awesome.

That cathedral is FREAKING SWEET! thumbsup thumbsup Did you come up with that layout by yourself? Just Wow Sir, yes sir! Keep us posted as you continue on that.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Fri 3 Oct 2008 - 23:19

The cottage and watchtower were originally intended for WFB so playability in the Mordheim sense wasn't really an issue. They were more just supposed to be in the way.

The cathedral layout is loosely inspired by a gothic church that Gary James from TerraGenesis created. But other than that (and the graveyard inspiration that I mentioned earlier), I guess the rest was me. I did take a look at some gothic cathedrals online though (including Notre Dame). Still, this is tiny and simplistic compared to those.

One thing that has been a struggle is figuring out how to suggest more detail than is actually there. As you add more bits, it starts to get crowded and strangely looses a sense of reality.

Or I'm nuts and have had too much time to think about this stuff while adhering roof tiles.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 0:57

Wow, that cathedral is unbelievable!! It looks awesome! I had a idea for a church as well (a late roman basilica with 2 aisles) but I hold it of for my wizzard tower project. Keep it up!
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 1:09

VERY NICE STUFF! thumbsup

The cottage is a trip down Memory Lane. Although I no longer have the WD it appeared in, I DO remember the article, AND yours is BETTER. Do you remember the Dwarf Mine Entrance one? That was a cool idea: I wonder why WD doesn't do that sort of thing anymore.

The Tower is REALLY well done; it's rather Dave Andrewsish & possessed [ affraid ] of a certain charm all its own.

The Cathedral ABSOLUTELY ROCKS! VERY WELL DONE! I LOVE the lower level; beyond being a beautiful piece of fabrication, it HAS so many gaming possibilities. There are a LOT of excellent ideas to steal from your WIP photos. Thanks MUCHO for the post!
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 3:12

That's some great stuff! I look forward to seeing how the cathedral shapes up. It does look very impressive in its current state already!

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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 4:13

Thats awesome! really welldone sofar :O do you've got the plans still lying around?
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 4:35

A small idea for the non ruined buildings. Walkways around the roofs and steps up.

Make it like the building was recieving repairs with wooden ladder/steps up to walkways round it and maybe along the roof. They an be removeable and modular so you can put them round any buildings then.

Doing something similiar to the non ruined builds I have.

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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 8:34

I am loving the cathederal. It is unbelievab le.


I agree on exacto blades and their cost. I have gone the route of razor blades but you still go through them quickly and if you don't change them often the foam core cuts look jagged.

If your cathederal ever needs a good home let me know. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 8:51

Amazing. Absolutely amazing looking terrain.

The two WFB buildings are beautifully done - I remember those WD articles as well (and I agree with you, Deafnala, these look even better. Also, it's a good question: why don't GW do this sort of thing anymore?). Anyway, back to the buildings - the detail is perfect -- just the write amount. And the painting is fantastic.

But the cathedral. I have to say (hard as it is) that I just don't think...

...that anything I build will top something like this! Unbelievable. It's already looking amazing, and while it's clearly a lot of work, it's worth it, because this is going to be a real centrepiece - and one with great gaming opportunities too. I'm in the process of planning a Great Library for our Mordheim terrain, and my plan was to build it like a gothic cathedral, so I'll be watching this with interest - and envy!

Amazing.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 9:41

wamez wrote:
One thing that has been a struggle is figuring out how to suggest more detail than is actually there. As you add more bits, it starts to get crowded and strangely looses a sense of reality.
That is a struggle. I think my only suggestion would be texture. You probably can add texture to the walls with paint (since they are supposed to be smooth?)

I really can't wait to see how you finish it. Great job on the removable building. It came out great.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 9:59

Thank you all for the kind words! It's definitely encouraging, especially having been skulking around this forum for so long and seeing the level of artistry you all have. Believe me that inspiration is a two way street.

@DeafNala - Yes, I actually have the WD with the Dwarf Mine and always planned to build one of my own (since I'm in love with Dwarves...for some reason) but never did. Maybe I can figure a way to squeeze one into the Mordheim theme. Hmm.

@Tagnator - The plans are not in a state that would make any sense to anyone other than me, but if there is enough interest, I can certainly spend some time putting something together. Let me know!

@Duce - (a) Love the ninja/monkey(?). (b) I LOVE your idea for scaffolding around the non-ruined buildings. That is pure genius, and will be looked into the moment the cathedral is done. Seriously. Awesome. It's a challenge not to drop everything and do that first!

@Ashton - I keep going back and forth about the texture. On one side, I do want it to look like smooth, carved stone (so not too much texture) but on the other, a light coat may add a level a realism. I may actually do a test first and go from there. If I do it, it will probably be a very light coat. I usually make my own from glue and spackling, so I should be able to adjust as necessary.

I'm hoping to make some progress on all the roof areas this weekend. I'm juggling this project and a new Skaven warband. I need more focus.

Thanks again!
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 18:32

Dude, the cathedral is sweet. Very nice architecture and a piece of very playable Mordheim scenery.

For the texturing I'd reccomend using polyfilla/spackle. Either work it with a sculpting tool while it's wet or use a blade to carve the detailing once it's set. I love the idea of marking out the flagstones with card squares as well. You can consider that idea well and truly stolen.

Oh, and for those struggling with X-Acto blades & craft knives (I had the blade of a cheap craft knife snap off and smack me in the face a couple of weeks ago) can I suggest you invest in one of these: http://www.stanleytools.com/default.asp?TYPE=PRODUCT&PARTNUMBER=10-049

They're made by Stanley, the blades are razor sharp and hold an edge well and are easily replaced. I can't recommend them highly enough. I've used mine for cutting everything from foamcard to matchsticks and the blade still cuts through foamcard without tearing it.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 4 Oct 2008 - 22:27

Great design! Definitely one I would like to emulate parts of in my terrain. Thanks for sharing. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sun 5 Oct 2008 - 16:43

GW should make stuff like this.

Heck they could sell kits already cut out my machine from foam core and I believe people would snap them up.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Mon 6 Oct 2008 - 6:47

Da Bank wrote:
GW should make stuff like this.

Heck they could sell kits already cut out my machine from foam core and I believe people would snap them up.

No, they'd put a 700% markup on it and only the Sultan of Brunei would be able to afford the bloody thing.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Thu 9 Oct 2008 - 19:20

wow wow wow ! the playable catacombs is awesome, i know exactly what graveyard you are referring too and i've been temped to make something similar myself. I think the best way to keep yourself from going mad while cutting cardboard squares is to limit them to corners and random patches like you have in the catacombs. Textured paint should fill in the flat areas and create the illusion of more detail.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Tue 21 Oct 2008 - 20:17

There is progress. But I have a few questions for anyone who's got an opinion.

First, pictures...







I have a lot of little things to address, I know. But my biggest question right now is whether I need to allow the roof to come off or not. Currently, the corner tower roofs come off and I would like to run a series of roof tiles along the peek of the main roof. But the only way to get the main roof off will be to keep the tower walls above any roof area completely clear of "stone work" because the roof is flush to the walls in those areas. I'll also probably have to glue a couple of foam core supports beneath the roof to keep the angle consistent as it comes off (or the tiles along the center will eventually bend and die).

Anyway, my question is: do you think there's enough access to the interior if I glue the roof on permanently? I'd like it to be as playable as possible, but those blank walls really bug me.

Any questions or criticisms are welcome. I'm still not 100% sure this is going to work. Shocked
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Wed 22 Oct 2008 - 2:42

WOW! Very impressive!

It's hard to tell whether you really need to be able to lift off the roof, when you don't see it in reality. From the pictures it seems as if the hole is big enough to move minis around inside the church. So I don't know really...

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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Wed 22 Oct 2008 - 4:11

JUST BEAUTIFUL! thumbsup

This is REALLY impressive, AND not just for the sheer size of the Beasty; the level of detailing would make it a centerpiece model in and of itself. BRAVO!
For the main part of the Cathedral, there isn't much point in having the roof detachable as long as you can get your hand inside, being mindful MOST gamers are Ham Fisted Oafs; it is basically one lage room. Having the roofs come off the towers. however, would probably be a good idea. Well that's my two cents worth. Suspect
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sat 25 Oct 2008 - 23:05

If you could, seeing a picture of your hand inside the hole in the roof may help some people judge if it is big enough. If you can fit your hand in there up to your wrist and open and close your fingers, that's usually good enough. If you want it even easier to make your games move along quicker, then take it off all together. Judging from the pictures, it appears to be bigger than some holes in roofs I have seen that people were still able to get under.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sun 26 Oct 2008 - 11:28

That is so rad looking! Wow

wamez wrote:
Anyway, my question is: do you think there's enough access to the interior if I glue the roof on permanently? I'd like it to be as playable as possible, but those blank walls really bug me.

I would say you have a large enough hole to not need a detachable roof... but I'm sure there will be places on a mordheim board that you should not place this building (like the very center)... as it can make it extremely hard to see or move models inside of it. I may be wrong, but that's what I think from the pictures.

I would probably glue the roof down.

Can you elaborate on the different materials you used on this building? It's fantastic. Thanks.
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PostSubject: Re: wamez WIP - Ruined Cathedral (and some other stuff)   Sun 26 Oct 2008 - 16:48

OK. Here's a shot with my hand inside. I guess I have average-sized hands. Maybe a little on the small side. That mini there is a Black Skaven.



I'm starting to think that leaving the roof permanently glued may be okay. But I'm still happy to hear any opinions.
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