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 Wolf Priest of Ulric

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Aipha
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PostSubject: Wolf Priest of Ulric   Sun 12 Jan 2014 - 15:17

We have some small 'issues' with the Wolf Priest of Ulric. First of all, he's fun to play with, so no problem there, but when it comes to his Prayers - wow, they're just OFF. I like them all, but the dificulties, descriptions, etc. are just not in order, except perhaps Ulric's Howl, which I've not included in the question here. I'm quoting the rest, and then telling my concerns and asking my questions:

Quote :
Snow Squall: Ulric extends his protection to the Wolf Priest in the form of a localized snow squall that engulfs the model. All enemy models in hand-to-hand combat with the priest are at -1 to hit due to the swirling snow and winds. The spell lasts for the duration of the hand-to-hand combat. Difficulty 6

"[D]uration of the hand-to-hand combat? So until this specific close combat is over? Could take rounds. No 'until stunned, knocked down, DEAD'? Very weird imo. For 6+ that seems pretty OP. We've changed it, so that it needs to be recast every round, but lasts own and opponent's close combat. Any other suggestions?

Quote :
Hammerschlag: The Wolf Priest calls down a hammer blow from Ulric on any model within 6". That model suffers a S4 attack from an enormous ethereal hammer, including the concussion special rule. Difficulty 10

Difficulty 10 for a S4 attack with concussion and a 6" range? Lawls. This is so bad I can't even describe it. Would never ever use this if I had something else. Range, S4 and concussion is probably fine, but how about 7+ or so? That's what Hammer of Sigmar is, and that's 10 times better than this in most cases.

Quote :
Bloodlust: The Wolf Priest is infused with a lust for battle and attacks wildly All attacks are at S +2, and he scores a critical hit on a 5-6. The Wolf Priest must test, by rolling the prayer's difficulty or greater on 2D6, each turn to see if the prayer remains in effect. Difficulty 7

This is close to Hammer of Sigmar actually, and might be in order. Perhaps 8+, but then again, I think Hammer of Sigmar should be at least 8+ as well.

Quote :
Wolf's Hunger: One member of the warband (priest's choice) is thrown into a Frenzy (See page 39 of the Mordheim rulebook for details.) Difficulty 7

"One member of the warband"... Is that pr. round (that's how we play it atm.) or at any one time? Is it removed by anything else than normal frenzy rules (I suppose not)? 7+ depends on whether it's on one or many, but this is quite powerful if you get a Holy Tome as well and frenzy half the warband before you engage.

Quote :
Call of Ulric: The Wolf Priest lets out a cry of agony as his body re-shapes itself into that of a huge, slavering wolf with the following profile below. Difficulty 10

Wolf Form
6 4 0 4 4 1 5 2 6
Wolf Form (max)
7 6 0 4 4 3 7 3 7

During the time that the priest is in the form of a wolf, he may do nothing but attack as a wolf: no spell-casting or weapons use. He still hates Sigmar's minions, however. In each shooting phase, the priest may choose to make a Ld test (using the Wolfs Ld 6) to regain his human form. If he is still in wolf form at the end of the battle he gets one last chance to return to human form. If he does not, then he remains a wolf forever! He is still a hero, and thus entitled to XP gains and attribute increases. He may only choose skills from the Speed Table, with the exception of Scale Sheer Surfaces.

So, he may only chose skills from the Speed table, but does he lose current skills from the other skill tables? Like Wyrdstone Hunter, Step Aside or so?
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Von Kurst
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PostSubject: Re: Wolf Priest of Ulric   Sun 12 Jan 2014 - 16:45

I'm not looking it up.  TC or Miracle Workers?  I think you are quoting TC.  There's a topic on the Miracle Workers one somewhere. ('cause I commented in it if I didn't start it.)

Quote :
but when it comes to his Prayers - wow, they're just OFF.

This from the guy who thinks Quickshot and handguns go together.  Rolling Eyes 

You've said what your problem with Snow Squall is but I don't get it.  Since it can only be cast on the Priest then it is obviously ineffective if he is knocked down or stunned (since there is no longer a to hit roll) and moot if he is OoA.  He's human, can't wear a helmet and let me tell you; its just not that hard to take him down.  Not getting the problem there.

Hammerschlag, well ja, I never bothered with that either.  House rule away.

Bloodlust is much better written than the Hammer of Sigmar.  Much.

Wolf's Hunger--ja but then half your warband can be forced to engage before the Middenheimers are ready too.  We have had a house rule for frenzy for so long that I have forgotten why this could be scary.

I never bothered with Wolf Form,  I expect its up to your group.
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PostSubject: Re: Wolf Priest of Ulric   Mon 13 Jan 2014 - 6:56

I would recomendhouseruling TC prayers before using Miracle Workers priests. They are not quite balanced.
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Aipha
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PostSubject: Re: Wolf Priest of Ulric   Mon 13 Jan 2014 - 9:53

Von Kurst wrote:
I'm not looking it up.  TC or Miracle Workers?  I think you are quoting TC.  There's a topic on the Miracle Workers one somewhere. ('cause I commented in it if I didn't start it.)

TC.

Von Kurst wrote:
This from the guy who thinks Quickshot and handguns go together.  Rolling Eyes

I presume you've misread my post. I was talking about a Dwarf with a Crossbow and a Handgun (or Rifle) - if you walk, use Handgun, if you don't, use Crossbow Wink and Quick Shot, not Quickshot Razz thought a veteran like you knew that!

Von Kurst wrote:
You've said what your problem with Snow Squall is but I don't get it.  Since it can only be cast on the Priest then it is obviously ineffective if he is knocked down or stunned (since there is no longer a to hit roll) and moot if he is OoA.

Well, it says all in H2H with him. Doesn't say hits against him, just those involved in a hand-to-hand combat with him. Our interpretation - all enemies in base contact with him, whoever they're trying to hit.

Von Kurst wrote:
Hammerschlag, well ja, I never bothered with that either.  House rule away.

Mhmm.

Von Kurst wrote:
Bloodlust is much better written than the Hammer of Sigmar.  Much.

I'm gonna have to calculate that, now that you're so sure Very Happy

Von Kurst wrote:
Wolf's Hunger--ja but then half your warband can be forced to engage before the Middenheimers are ready too.  We have had a house rule for frenzy for so long that I have forgotten why this could be scary.

What house rule? And yeah, we do too now, 1 attack extra, so right, frenzy ain't that good anymore. But without. Daym.

Thanks for the comments king 
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PostSubject: Re: Wolf Priest of Ulric   Mon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:22

The snow squall should probably be difficulty 8+, but otherwise I don;t see that much of a problem with it; I tend to think of things from a fluff perspective to justify them, and having a swirling wind would throw you off balance no matter who you fought in the vicinity. I think it is cheap for what it does, but think the power level of the ability is fine in all hoensty- for the reasons Von Kurst stated about it not counting when you're KD or Stunned.

The nearest comparison to Hammerslag in my mind would be the Fires of Uzhul in Lesser Magic.

Hammerschlag is at -18" range compared to Fires and has a much higher difficulty rating... it does have the concussion rule though, so you know... apparently that's balanced...

The rest if his abilities generally seem very powerful to me, which is why despite loving Middenheimers (as my first official warband they have a special place) I have never felt ok with wheeling him out and adding the Priest to the ranks.

I can see why the Frenzy spell isn't as great as you might imagine, since you can pull people out of formation (and is it possible to make Frenzied models charge off of roofs/ walls/ dangerous terrain if a model is in their charge range? if so this could be a terrible spell if improperly applied...) so it has it's pros and cons and seems more balanced than it might first appear.

Wolf Form just seemed insane to me- possibly amazing damage potential but with a crippling downside that could royally screw you up... seems like a fit for Skaven players making the transition to the Human warbands Wink
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PostSubject: Re: Wolf Priest of Ulric   Mon 13 Jan 2014 - 20:12

Quote :
I presume you've misread my post. I was talking about a Dwarf with a Crossbow and a Handgun (or Rifle) - if you walk, use Handgun, if you don't, use Crossbow  Wink and Quick Shot, not Quickshot  Razz  thought a veteran like you knew that!

 lol!  I don't know though, everyone else took you at your word, too...

Quote :
I'm gonna have to calculate that, now that you're so sure

I mean the rule is much better written, as in the language used and the clarity. The prayer Hammer of Sigmar is a mess. Its vague and requires a house rule just to include in games. Awful writing. And it shows up in no FAQs or Erratas despite its obvious flaws. At least the Wolf Priest's rules have the excuse of being fan-made.

Quote :
Our interpretation - all enemies in base contact with him, whoever they're trying to hit.
Well, OK. Since our group occasionally encounters a similar rule because of the Necarch's Cursed Book, I still don't see it as that big a deal.

catachanfrog wrote:

I would recommend house ruling TC prayers before using Miracle Workers priests. They are not quite balanced.

True, but they are WIP and werekin is open to feedback and discussion. The thread on this forum is titled Priests of the Empire. There is a discussion of the Wolf Priest on page 4 or 5.
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PostSubject: Re: Wolf Priest of Ulric   Today at 20:04

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