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 BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective

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catachanfrog
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PostSubject: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Wed 11 Dec 2013 - 9:27

Warbands with "The Damned Shall Burn!" earn 1CP per chaos/undead hero that dies after the battle. My question is about captured chaos/undead heroes - do I benefit from "Slain Heretic" by killing them?
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Wed 11 Dec 2013 - 11:06

This is for the authors to correct, but my impression is that the goal is fulfilled - the chaos/undead Hero is dead after all, and that's a good thing!

Plus. If the captured Hero is burned, I guess you're as close as you'll get!
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Wed 11 Dec 2013 - 13:54

Let's look at the rules.
Quote :
+1 Slain Heretic. Whenever a Hero of any Chaos or Undead warband taken out of action by the warband dies permanently after a battle the warband gets +1 CP.

  • Was the Hero taken OOA by the warband? Yes. (Honestly I would also still count it even if the enemy Hero was captured after going OOA by a random event or some other method.)
  • Did the Hero die permanently after the battle? Yes.

The warband that killed the Hero would definitely get +1 CP.
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Aipha
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Thu 12 Dec 2013 - 4:55

Quote :
+1 Slain Heretic. Whenever a Hero of any Chaos or Undead warband taken out of action by the warband dies permanently after a battle the warband gets +1 CP.

Technically, if he is taken OOA by the warband and then dies permanently after a battle - i.e. any battle - the warband should get +1 CP.

I suppose that's not how it was intended though, and it was meant to read "the battle".
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cianty
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Thu 12 Dec 2013 - 11:39

Aipha wrote:
I suppose that's not how it was intended though, and it was meant to read "the battle".

Yep.

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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Thu 12 Dec 2013 - 13:21

What is the difference between killing in a battle and killing after a battle if captured? A warrior still took the Hero OOA which involved some form of attack. The only difference is that the Serious Injury Role was different.

Perhaps the thing that is important is if the Hero was captured after being taken OOA by some other means (blackpowder misfire, random event, etc) as it required no effort on behalf of the warband.
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catachanfrog
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Thu 12 Dec 2013 - 16:14

Thanks for all replies guys.
RationalLemming wrote:
What is the difference between killing in a battle and killing after a battle if captured? A warrior still took the Hero OOA which involved some form of attack. The only difference is that the Serious Injury Role was different.
Exactly. My reasoning is that "dead heretic is a dead heretic" - I can always kill him in battle or if I mange to capture him after taking him OoA ie. by my warriors attack, not by some "I fell from the stairs, went OoA and rolled 61" or "my pistol backfired at me and I rolled 61 as RationalLemming pointed out.
So. how is that?
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Thu 12 Dec 2013 - 18:20

RationalLemming wrote:
Serious Injury Role

Is this some kind of internal way of writing 'roll'? Razz

Anyway, as cianty confirmed: If the Hero in question is taken OOA by the warband, that warband receives +1 CP, if he dies after the battle.

I wouldn't count random deaths, because of this reason: Multiplayer games. Only the warband who was actually the cause of the death, should be rewarded (this sounds rather harsh actually!)
Which means, that only if he was killed permanently by the warband, will that warband be rewarded. This further leads to the conclusion, that a killed captured Hero will reward this as well.

However, I'm unaware, at the current moment, which warbands can choose this path. Some of them might not have the option of killing their captive.

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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Fri 13 Dec 2013 - 1:06

@Aipha... lol
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Fri 13 Dec 2013 - 3:52

Wut? Razz I think I've seen someone write it like that before, so I was just wondering!
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Fri 13 Dec 2013 - 8:20

Aipha wrote:
However, I'm unaware, at the current moment, which warbands can choose this path. Some of them might not have the option of killing their captive.
True, but imagine this: witch hunter player captures a spellcaster. More than that - a CHAOS spellcaster!!! affraid 
What are they going to do: burn him at the stake or try to make money on his ransom?
Same with any chaos/undead hero (not mentioning things like orcs and dark elves). I know, they cannot do that by the rulebook (because rules suck in this matter), but I think it is quite reasonable (and true to background/warband flavour) to play like this. Cool
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Fri 13 Dec 2013 - 10:27

To help bring an end to this discussion... The clarifiied rule should read:

+1 Slain Heretic. Whenever a Hero of any Chaos or Undead warband taken out of action by the warband dies permanently after the battle, i.e. a result of 11-15 is rolled for the Serious Injury, the warband gets +1 CP.

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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Fri 13 Dec 2013 - 11:31

Now it's clear. (Even if a bit unfair Wink )
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Fri 13 Dec 2013 - 15:21

catachanfrog wrote:
Now it's clear. (Even if a bit unfair Wink )

Why do you think it is unfair?

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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Fri 13 Dec 2013 - 16:20

Well, unfair mayby is not the word - but really, executing captured heretic is less effective/worthy than killing him in battle? Wink 
But you're the chief. Sir, yes sir! 


Last edited by catachanfrog on Mon 16 Dec 2013 - 12:30; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Fri 13 Dec 2013 - 20:24

I guess the problem with executing your captive is that witch hunters are not one of the warbands that are allowed to do so by the basic rules.  My group always allows anybody to kill a captive if they really want to, but RAW only allows Undead or Chaotics to kill a captive hero.

In our version of the Let the Damned Burn Objective I made killing a captive hero a special scenario, Burn the Witch.  I think you can find the scenario in one of the drop boxes if you are interested. (Broken V's maybe?)
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Sat 14 Dec 2013 - 2:06

I am interested. Can you provide mi with a link?
Indeed, by raw witch hunters cannot kill captives - it needs house rulling.
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Sat 14 Dec 2013 - 7:28

https://docs.google.com/folderview?pli=1&id=0B18J5DU-6cP_cnF2R3BMcUpkWlk&tid=0B18J5DU-6cP_aEg2dHIxbGpaMlk#docId=0B18J5DU-6cP_aVk1UzlhM0tpYm8

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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Mon 16 Dec 2013 - 11:02

Thanks von Kurst!
Unfortunately it is not an option I'm looking for:-)
Giving a chance of retake captured model who's after all in my clutches is to much a risk for mere 1 xp. Also I'd change fire rules in this scenario. After 3rd round victim at the stake takes S1 (increasing with each turn) hit and still has to roll for injuries? It seems that this scenario was made with "recapturing" warband in mind cause it will be ages for someone to burn at this stake.
In that case I'll just sell someone to slavery.
ANOTHER QUESTION:
In "power of the Church" achievement - instead of TC warrior priests, can I hire ones from "Mirracle workers"? Of course equipping them on my cost. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Mon 3 Feb 2014 - 1:30

I agree. Witch Hunters do not kill captives. They torture them, usually this culminates in a public execution involving fire.

The achievement is geared to reward a player for taking heathen models out of action during battles. This should be self explanatory so I do not understand why anyone would be fishing for reeasons to get a further bonus from unrelated events that occur in the post battle sequence.

There are existing rules for how to set on fire enemy warriors. There is a summary in the Border Town Burning fire rules. These could be used as a point of reference, if you with to burn mutants and witches in a battle. Very fitting with the fluff!

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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Tue 18 Feb 2014 - 12:27

I've run out of time tonight to blog about how the Witch Hunter Captain of Bournemouth UK deals with warlocks and heretics, but I have slipped a new set of warband objectives and achievements for city based campaign play into my Dropbox account. This will be for the more zealous of players to try out!

Plot - Drowning the Witch

Regards,

Werekin
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PostSubject: Re: BTB "The Damned Shall Burn!" objective   Today at 23:00

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