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Mike
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PostSubject: Frenzy   Tue 15 Feb 2011 - 0:41

Is a model under the effects of Frenzy required to make an initiative test to charge a model out of sight but not hidden or can it ignore that model for charge.

Also if more than one model is in charge range may the frenzied model choose which to charge or is it the closest model?

Thanks!
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Louis
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Tue 15 Feb 2011 - 2:51

I would say that he has to check Initiative to charge around the corner, if he is aware that there is an enemy within range. I don't think it is written any where, but I feel it is the spirit of the Frenzy-state.
But have a talk with your group about it.

Frenzied warriors makes their frenzy.char-es, after other charges have been declared. If there are two models within range, just declare the charge on the one you would rather fight.
You can still declare charges with frenzies as normal remember.

The only option you don't have, is not to charge enemies within reach.

If you decide not to declare a charge on one of them, and he has to charge. I think the spirit is to charge the closest.

Hope this helps.
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mweaver
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Tue 15 Feb 2011 - 5:29

I agree with Louis's answers to both questions.

The initiative test is used to determine whether or not a warrior realizes an enemy is out of sight, but actually close. There is no reason a frenzied warrior would have extra-acute senses about that sort of thing.

The rules just say he must charge if there is an enemy within range. Since they don't specify closest model, you have a choice if more than one enemy model is within range.
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Mike
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Tue 15 Feb 2011 - 11:33

Thanks for the answers. We are enjoying the game very much!
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mweaver
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Tue 15 Feb 2011 - 16:43

Mordheim is an awesome game.
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StyrofoamKing
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Tue 15 Feb 2011 - 19:06

In our group, we house rule it that you have to charge the closest. If two are equal distance, THEN you can choose which.
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mweaver
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Tue 15 Feb 2011 - 19:42

So far we haven't house-ruled Frenzy, but there seems to be growing sentiment for only letting it add +1 attack, rather than double the attack characteristic.
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Louis
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Wed 16 Feb 2011 - 2:24

StyrofoamKing wrote:
In our group, we house rule it that you have to charge the closest. If two are equal distance, THEN you can choose which.

But when declaring charges, you can just declare one with the frenzied model, on the furthers away opponent, if that's the one you would rather fight...
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siredge
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Thu 17 Feb 2011 - 12:59

Another question on Frenzy. With the dwarf slayer skill Ferocious Charge you can double your attacks with a -1 to hit. So if that model was under frenzy would you double the double? it seems crazy obviously but im not sure what route to take with that.
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Mike
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Thu 17 Feb 2011 - 13:11

Quote :
Frenzied warriors fight with double their Attacks characteristic in hand-to-hand combat. Warriors with
1 Attack therefore have 2 Attacks, warriors with 2 Attacks have 4, etc. If a warrior is carrying a weapon in
each hand, he receives +1 Attack for this as normal. This extra Attack is not doubled.

From the rulebook. Only the base attack characteristic is doubled. Our Middenheimer player with the Wolf Priest frenzy spell would be crushing us more than normal if they could pull off even more attacks.
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siredge
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Thu 17 Feb 2011 - 13:15

I guess it would make it so you would always have 2x attacks


ok so what about special attacks? for instance the saurus bite attack or the centigor trample attack. Would frenzy affect those?
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BalrogTheBuff
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Thu 17 Feb 2011 - 14:08

I played that they ARE doubled, but two attacks must be made with the special bite, trample etc.
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Thu 17 Feb 2011 - 14:31

Since those types of attacks(Bite, Trample or Chaos mutations) are not 'base attacks' we do not play that they are affected by frenzy.

Long ago we changed the Frenzy rule to +1 attack as per the Warhammer 6th edition change. It works much better and does away with monster characters. At present our Vampires are having enough trouble with 4 or 5 attack Frenzied Totem Warriors. 8 or 9 attack Totem Warriors would just be silly.

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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Thu 17 Feb 2011 - 18:48

siredge wrote:
Another question on Frenzy. With the dwarf slayer skill Ferocious Charge you can double your attacks with a -1 to hit. So if that model was under frenzy would you double the double? it seems crazy obviously but im not sure what route to take with that.

On a side note: dwarven slayers are immune to psychology and thus cant be frenzied. Though if you did allow it I would say that it doubles the base attacks, so in the end doubling a double would end up as 3* the original.
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Fri 18 Feb 2011 - 2:49

This original frenzy rule is obviously broken. It might work as long as heroes have 1 maybe 2 basic attacks. But as soon as they get 3 and more, it becomes... well, rigth - silly and imo it spoils the game. Not mentioning combinations of frenzy with those special rules and possibility to combine it with other skills. The original frenzy rule was simply overtaken from 5th ed. WHFB, where it was limited to some particular regiments and where it worked somehow (dropped later on in 6th ed. though). But in Mordheim, where one can combine various skills and stats are continuously rising, gets the issue completely different scale.
Making frenzy +1 A solves almost all problems and avoids any rediculous situations.
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Fri 18 Feb 2011 - 7:55

Yeah the Frenzy rules as written are too powerful once you get above 2 attacks. I had a Skink with Frenzy and 3 attacks so they doubled to 6 so he was a killing machine, even with his off hand holding a shield. One time I poisoned his sword, it was nasty. I usually sent him out with at least 2 henchmen with spears to take any charges and keep people from double teaming him.
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PostSubject: Re: Frenzy   Today at 23:54

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