HomeFAQSearchRegisterUsergroupsBlogLog inGolden Tom 2014 Thread!

Share | 
 

 Shields-Our house rule

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
MTD
Youngblood
Youngblood


Posts : 5
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2010-02-18

PostSubject: Shields-Our house rule   Tue 11 May 2010 - 8:18

We decided that to make shields more important and useful to modify their use. They always add +1 to armor and can be used either to bash the opponent at the user's strength at -1 to hit or to parry, where you can parry if you tie the roll rather than just beat it. They cannot do both in the same turn.

It has worked rather well and everyone seems to like it.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Popmouth
Ancient
Ancient


Posts : 479
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2008-12-10
Age : 29
Location : Gothemburg, Sweden

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Kislevites Kislevites
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Tue 11 May 2010 - 8:31

Seems quite a lot though for 5gc... though I think +1 to AS in CC is a good house rule (we use it)
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Opheliate
Venerable Ancient
Venerable Ancient


Posts : 855
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2009-11-12
Age : 31
Location : Sweden

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Skaven Skaven
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Tue 11 May 2010 - 9:28

I like the idea of shield bashing... but maybe as a strength skill, no?

Shield Bash.
The warrior gets an extra attack, which always strikes last. The attack is carried out by using either a buckler or shield. A buckler Shield Smash will be at strength like user -1, and a shield bash using anormal shield will be at the users S.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://sites.google.com/site/denofdamnation/
hero
Elder
Elder


Posts : 310
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2009-01-05

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Tue 11 May 2010 - 9:51

If you really want to make shields competitive for more than just particular, armored heroes you can't have their bonus tied to a skill.

A bash goes a long way to redressing the issue. Honestly, with how poorly armor saves perform in Mordheim I wouldn't be against letting shields straight up grant an additional attack just like dual wielding. Consider that it would then be 5 gc for a shield that gives an +1 A and +1 AS, and also 5 gc for an axe that gives +1 A and -1 AS.

Of course, it doesn't necessarily FEEL right, though I think people greatly under estimate how a shield can be used on the offensive.

We've decided to just get rid of bucklers and make shields grant parry by default, and we're seeing how that works.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
REminenz
Champion
Champion


Posts : 47
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2010-03-20
Location : Vienna, Austria

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Dwarfs Dwarfs
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Tue 11 May 2010 - 11:00

May I point you to our house rules..
http://boringmordheimforum.forumieren.com/rules-and-gameplay-f1/w22-house-rules-t3608.htm
.. where we presented a shield bash technique very similar to yours..

And a shameless quote of myself:
REminenz wrote:
...
Key changes:
  • -1 to hit when using two weapons (including weapon + shield)
  • added new combat skill to compensate for that
  • +1 AS on all armor types except toughened leather in hand-to-hand combat
  • shields and bucklers have the shield bash special rule which grants +1A that hits on a fixed 5+ and suffers -2 on injury rolls
  • added new combat skill to make shield bash attacks hit based on WS
  • Critical hits dont ignore armour but rather give a -2 modifier
  • Handguns roll 2 injury dice and may cause and all alone test
  • Same for the Hochland Long rifle but with S5
  • Spears grant +1I in the first round of hand-to-hand combat
The -1 to hit modificator should balance out one-handed and two-handed (spear, morning star, halberd, THW, ..) weapons.
The shield bash special rule should make shields more attractive in comparison to a second weapon.
With shields being more common, the enhanced (+1AS) armours could also be seen more frequently.
And with armour in general more present the axe should also have it's place in game.
...
Back to top Go down
View user profile
CygnusMaximus
Warlord
Warlord


Posts : 230
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2008-07-15
Location : Utah, USA

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Averlanders Averlanders
Achievements earned:

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Tue 11 May 2010 - 14:08

While I like the idea of shield-bashing, I'm squarely in Opheliate's camp in my thinking that it should be a skill (as I stated in REminenz's thread).

In my opinion, an important part of fixing shields and various other weapon options is making dual wield worse somehow. I am a fan of the -1 to hit for all attacks when attacking with two weapons. Add an "ambidextrous" skill, give shields +1AS in close combat when used with a single-handed weapon and you'll find a LOT of different weapons and shields are suddenly more useful.

(See the Sticky on Dual Wielding if you want to see more on this.)
Back to top Go down
View user profile
hero
Elder
Elder


Posts : 310
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2009-01-05

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Tue 11 May 2010 - 17:36

The problem with buffing shields with a skill is that only heroes will be able to get it. Henchmen will still be better off dual wielding, and only specific heroes who people decide to stack armor on will bother with the shields.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
mweaver
Etheral
Etheral


Posts : 1411
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2010-01-13
Location : South Texas, U.S.A.

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Tue 11 May 2010 - 19:32

Like Popmouth, we are going with the simple additional +1 to armor saves in close combat. It does seem to me making shields quite a bit more popular.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Aldhick
Veteran
Veteran


Posts : 121
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2009-09-16
Age : 36
Location : Czech Republic, Brno

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Sisters of Sigmar Sisters of Sigmar
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Wed 12 May 2010 - 0:25

I like the skill version too. In our rule mod (besides necessary armor/shield buff and DW nerf already mentioned above) I'm following the idea of skills for every weapon, not just swords (swordsman, parry skills), making them all viable choices for heroes. And shield being in armour section is one I missed.
From my point of view on skills I'd rather prefer another effect, than additional attack (only Art of silent death with claws and Berserkr do this if I remember well). Maybe additional attack which cannot wound, but if succesfuly hit it makes the opponent to hit on -1 for the rest of that turn. It is not of permanent use in combat, but that is what most skills are like and IMO it's right.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Kpok
Hero
Hero


Posts : 30
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2010-01-11

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Witch Hunters Witch Hunters
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Wed 12 May 2010 - 4:25

In my group we house ruled shield with +1AS in close combat.
On the other hand we decided that it costs 15gc to get the dual wield ability with a -1 to hit modifier for the offhand and a new skill to compansate the -1 modifier.
It seems to work so far.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Opheliate
Venerable Ancient
Venerable Ancient


Posts : 855
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2009-11-12
Age : 31
Location : Sweden

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Skaven Skaven
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Wed 12 May 2010 - 5:35

Shouldnt shield be +1 As in ranged combat instead? Its easier to walk around with your shield raised in front of your body when fired upon. You cant just stand firm with your shild in close combat, as it will more or less actually deflect blows by countering them rather than just blocking, as is the case with missile fire.

A 5+ save vs missile weapons for shields is something I could agree on.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://sites.google.com/site/denofdamnation/
Popmouth
Ancient
Ancient


Posts : 479
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2008-12-10
Age : 29
Location : Gothemburg, Sweden

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Kislevites Kislevites
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Wed 12 May 2010 - 6:08

Maybe, though gamewise this would most likely make shields attractive to your best heroes, like the captain, and perhaps on your ballistic warriors (since they get a cheap protection against other shooters)
Back to top Go down
View user profile
mweaver
Etheral
Etheral


Posts : 1411
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2010-01-13
Location : South Texas, U.S.A.

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Wed 12 May 2010 - 6:55

Plus, I believe the additional +1 in close combat is present in Warhammer, so there is a consistency.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Rudeboy
Elder
Elder


Posts : 360
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2009-12-01
Age : 37

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Restless Dead (BTB) Restless Dead (BTB)
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Wed 12 May 2010 - 7:11

Our House rules was that if you had a shield and a hand weapon that was a 5+ armor save. It wasn't equal or better then duel wielding, but it made my lizardman hard to wound. All of my lizardmen had a 3+ or 4+ armor save between their Scaly Skin and a shield.

I like the idea of a shield bash. I always liked the Feat in D&D, and I think of skills in Mordheim as similar to Feats in D&D.

Maybe you could have a "Special" Shield that costs a little more, but gives you the Shield Bash ability.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
CygnusMaximus
Warlord
Warlord


Posts : 230
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2008-07-15
Location : Utah, USA

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Averlanders Averlanders
Achievements earned:

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Wed 12 May 2010 - 7:29

Opheliate wrote:
Shouldnt shield be +1 As in ranged combat instead? Its easier to walk around with your shield raised in front of your body when fired upon. You cant just stand firm with your shild in close combat, as it will more or less actually deflect blows by countering them rather than just blocking, as is the case with missile fire.

A 5+ save vs missile weapons for shields is something I could agree on.

The +1 save in combat represents the ability of a warrior to anticipate where his enemy will strike and his ability to move quickly enough to block it. It's a bit more difficult to do against arrows and bullets; if your shield was in the right place, you block it (hopefully), if it wasn't, you don't.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Shadowphx
General
General


Posts : 184
Trading Reputation : 0
Join date : 2009-11-05
Location : Phoenix, Az. U.S.A.

Personal Info
Primary Warband played: Skaven Skaven
Achievements earned: none

PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Wed 12 May 2010 - 15:10

I can see a wide range of possibilities here. The question is whether or not to make is a skill or ability. As a Skill it would only be for Heroes, or as an ability, it would be for any Weapon/Armor using fighter.



Here’s an Idea: Shield Bash- Wielder when charging attempts to knock opponent off his feet, putting all his strength from the charge behind his shield to disable his enemy rather than wound him. User is +1S verses Opponents S. If a Bash is successful, the opponent knocked back D3 inches from the Charger’s direction of travel and is in 1-3 is a “Knock Down.” or 4-6 is a “Stun”



The fun part would be if the opponent is near stairs, building edge, or table edge. The “fall” could even do more damage. Or at least Entertainment value for the other players.



Or an Idea of different style shields for different style uses, and of course different prices. Large shield - +2AS in close combat and against ranged, heavy -1 movement.

Standard Shield - +1AS in close combat and against ranged, reroll failed parry.

Edged Shield - +1AS in close combat and against ranged, reroll failed parry, Sharpened or Bladed edge (can be used as an off-hand weapon.)

Buckler – Parry

Spiked or Bladed Buckler – Parry, (can be used as an off-hand weapon.)



These are just Ideas, I never used or play tested.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Shields-Our house rule   Today at 11:05

Back to top Go down
 
Shields-Our house rule
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Babita aka Moonmoon Dutta on TMKOC set - Navratri Celebration
» Rule changes for shields & bucklers?
» Helmuth's Strongholds Battle for Arnhem ruined house 2
» Gerard Butler Big Apple House Hunter
» The Little House on the Prairie Comedy Thread

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Tom's Boring Mordheim Forum :: General Discussion :: Rules and Gameplay-
Jump to: