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Joker2and53
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PostSubject: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 10:37

Just a simple question I could not find an answer to. If a spell caster is equipped toughened leathers which grant a 6+ save and count as equipment, can that spell caster still cast spells? Normally, a spell caster can't wear armour and cast spells, but because toughed leathers are equipment, it seems to me that a spellcaster could be equipped with toughened leathers and still cast spells.

Thoughts?
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 10:40

My "rulesy" side is telling me to say no, but the fluff reason given that spellcasters can't wear armour is that metal interferes with their sensing the winds of magic. Leather is not metal and so shouldn't cause problems.

Tough call.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 14:05

We ruled that allowing it to work is a bit beardy and said spellcasters couldn't use it. After all if metal intefers why can't they use a wooden shield then which is armour under the rules?
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Louis
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 15:47

"A wizard may not use magic if he is wearing armour or has a shield or buckler."
- The rulebook p. 40

I've seen arguments that Toughened Leathers wheren't armour but equipment that granted armour save, so a wizard could use it, and still cast spells.

But I haven't seen anything official about it.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 16:42

Whatever armour a mage can wear.. should be very very expensieve and rare to buy.. and it would be a sort of magic protected robe... or something... (?)
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Lord 0
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 17:01

Toughened leathers aren't equipment any more - they are armour that counts as light armour for the purposes of equiping.

A needed change to my mind because now that it counts as armour you can give it to henchmen, which were pretty much the only people you would ever give it to anyway. Also clears up the whole 'is it armour or equipment' issue.

If you want your wizard to wear armour just get him the skill that will allow him to do so.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 18:23

Lord 0 wrote:
Toughened leathers aren't equipment any more - they are armour that counts as light armour for the purposes of equiping.

Says who?

I am running a nine person campaign and have house ruled that wearing toughened leathers does not affect the casting of spells, precisely because toughened leathers are equipment, just like lucky charms, garlic, etc. So far, it seems there is not a precise answer, so I guess the decision is reasonable.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 18:56

So where does the Toughened Leathers are equipment argument come from?

My TC#8 article on Pirates lists them under weapons and armour twice in the article...

If you've house ruled it end of story. Its your house rule.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Wed 24 Mar 2010 - 21:59

Joker2and53 wrote:
Says who?
I am afraid the best I can remember is 'one of the town cryers'. Not a particularly helpful answer, but there we go.
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Louis
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Thu 25 Mar 2010 - 4:51

On The Mordheimer's information centre there is an collection of all official FAQ, including this:

"Q: Who can wear the Toughened Leathers from the Opulent Goods chart in White
Dwarf #239?
A: Since they are purchased as equipment, all Heroes can wear them. Henchmen
cannot wear Toughened Leathers. [Games Workshop Official Mordheim's FAQ]"

It's true however, that Toughened leathers are allso found on the pirates warband equipment list, under armour.

So is it armour or equipment? In my gaming group we say it is equipment, and that spellcasters can wear it while casting spells.

But it's open to interpretation.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Thu 25 Mar 2010 - 4:55

Fair enough. Perhaps it was one of the earliest house rules our group adopted. Could have sworn I read it in a magazine though. *Shrug*.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Thu 25 Mar 2010 - 5:44

The pirates warband overwriting the Toughened Leathers rules for themselves doesn't mean that other warbands do the same.

The "Opulent Goods" article clearly introduces the Toughened Leathers item as a new piece of miscellaneous equipment (look it up). This was only re-stated by the FAQ entry posted by Louis. It is unfortunate that Mr Huckleberry wrote the rules in this way as it is confusing. Instead it would have been better to provide the warband with a special rule saying:
"All members of the pirate warband may buy and use toughened Leathers as a common item."
This would have prevented any confusion.

Back to the initial question: Yes, you can give Toughened Leathers to spellcasters (since it is technically no armour - the fluff reason is the missing metal I believe).

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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Tue 18 May 2010 - 11:42

Nope, you can't cast spells while wearing Toughened Leathers. This was answered in errata.

Quote :
Toughened Leathers: Add “Even thoughToughened Leathers are purchased as
miscellaneous equipment and need not be
listed on a Hero’s starting armour list to be
taken, they are still armour and prevent spell
casting.

I found this in the Mordheim FAQ, but it probably appeared first in a Town Cryer.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Tue 18 May 2010 - 14:30

Great find, db! I wasn't aware of this (and didn't find it in the Mordheimer FAQ). Thanks for pointing this point!!

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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Tue 18 May 2010 - 15:00

cianty wrote:
Great find, db! I wasn't aware of this (and didn't find it in the Mordheimer FAQ). Thanks for pointing this point!!
No Problem. The Mordheim FAQ I referred to can be found here: http://tabletopgeeks.com/wp-content/downloads/misc/MordheimFAQ.pdf

Also these Q&As are included in the Mordheim Annual.
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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Tue 18 May 2010 - 15:02

I usually just check Mordheim.com when looking for something. This is obviously not sufficient...

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PostSubject: Re: toughened leathers   Today at 17:20

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