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 Mordheim Freeware Project

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heylookitsmatt
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PostSubject: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sat 23 Jan 2010 - 11:04

I know enough about making games to know I can't make this by myself. I can, however, do the graphics! Anyone interested in handling the code? Below is a VERY rough mockup of a pair of Reiklanders distracted by a zombie and about to get pounced on by a sneaky vampire...



As you can see, I've based the character graphics on actual models. I have a fair amount of other pieces done including just about every common weapon in the game.

If you're interested, please contact me on Yahoo Instant Messenger (hey_look_its_matt) or email me at kyne_is_guilty@yahoo.com
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Mordheimer
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sat 23 Jan 2010 - 17:15

WOW! That is VERY cool!
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sartori
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sat 23 Jan 2010 - 17:50

Reminds me of Final Fantasy Tactics. Which just happens to be one of my favorite games of all time Smile
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heylookitsmatt
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sat 23 Jan 2010 - 20:02

Yes, I tried to match the dull colors from FFT for Playstation. I think it evokes the Mordheim atmosphere. I've pretty much got all the graphics I'll need to make human mercenaries warbands including picking a head and a body, displaying the weapons they are carrying, and picking a team color from around six or so.

I'd like to make a simple demo with just human warbands playing a 500 point single battle to gauge the community's interest. The terrain will likely be modular, mixing up buildings and set pieces I make together into a full board. Again, if you can code or know someone who might be interested, drop me a line!
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sat 23 Jan 2010 - 21:29

This will take a lot more effort than Vassal40k, which has a much, much larger fan base.

Mordheim is more tabletop-centric than 40k is; the hobby itself is as much a part of it as the game itself to many (most?) people - which is one of the failings of Vassal40k. The other, the difficulty in establishing line of sight and cover, will be even more noticeable in Mordheim, and not helped by the use of an isometric system. Many of the intricacies of the tabletop will be lost in the transformation to isometric, which is (though perhaps not inherently) grid-like.

Vassal is a better engine for this than a brand-new isometric one, and Vassal is not a good engine for Mordheim; several brave souls had thought about beginning development on such, but soon enough realised how poorly Mordheim translates to a birds-eye or isometric system.

The best advice I can give you is to not pursue this; if you can find a group of games programmers with a collective thousand to three thousand hours to spare, you will quite possibly end up with a neat little isometric game; but it won't be Mordheim, it won't enjoy significant support or adoption, and it will attract unwanted attention from Games Workshop. A year down the road, and you will be wishing you spent your time and effort on a breath-taking Mordheim table instead.
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sat 23 Jan 2010 - 22:57

I don't know, I'd play it. Particularly if there was a terrain design component.
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Opheliate
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 0:32

Crunch wrote:
This will take a lot more effort than Vassal40k, which has a much, much larger fan base.

Mordheim is more tabletop-centric than 40k is; the hobby itself is as much a part of it as the game itself to many (most?) people - which is one of the failings of Vassal40k. The other, the difficulty in establishing line of sight and cover, will be even more noticeable in Mordheim, and not helped by the use of an isometric system. Many of the intricacies of the tabletop will be lost in the transformation to isometric, which is (though perhaps not inherently) grid-like.

Vassal is a better engine for this than a brand-new isometric one, and Vassal is not a good engine for Mordheim; several brave souls had thought about beginning development on such, but soon enough realised how poorly Mordheim translates to a birds-eye or isometric system.

The best advice I can give you is to not pursue this; if you can find a group of games programmers with a collective thousand to three thousand hours to spare, you will quite possibly end up with a neat little isometric game; but it won't be Mordheim, it won't enjoy significant support or adoption, and it will attract unwanted attention from Games Workshop. A year down the road, and you will be wishing you spent your time and effort on a breath-taking Mordheim table instead.

This could well be true, but that doesn't mean one should not pursue the idea! I always thought the idea of Toms boring Mordheim Forum was to encourage people to keep the flame alive, not put it out! Yes, it might be hard, and yes, it will take long, but keeping the fire burning is more important than what you actually make of it.

I say go fot it! If it suceeds, you will be legen-wait for it-dary! If not, you will have inspired many ppl and helped Mordheim and the hobby a great deal by just having shown your enthusiasm.
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Myntokk
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 1:44

Crunch wrote:
soon enough realised how poorly Mordheim translates to a birds-eye or isometric system.
On the contrary, I think that by far the best warband or small team-based, rpg video games are done in this style (the whole gamut of Final Fantasy Tactics games, Tactics Ogre, and the X-com series, for instance).

However, I do think that it's important to heed Crunch's warning, to the extent that to make a good Mordheim video game would require A LOT of time an effort. Nonetheless, I think it's totally worth pursuing, even if it doesn't come to a fully-fledged game with a campaign system it will be a fun project and will give those of us who are interested in a Mordheim computer game a glimpse of what one could be like.

Are the human mercenaries' colors based on the existing province warbands?


Last edited by Myntokk on Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 17:16; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 4:19

maybe Svenn could be of some assistance? i know he's in the gaming industry
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 5:40

I have a good programming background, and extensive IT administration background (it's been my day job for many years). Programming Mordheim would not be that hard, although I'd prefer a straight-up 3D environment with viewpoints that could be cycled between warband members to help with LOS, and alternated with a bird's-eye view for overall movement and such (as this is what we do in the tabletop game).

However, I should expand on what Crunch alluded to from GW: at least one Mordheim project on Vassal has already drawn the ire of GW, and they did force it to be removed. For that reason alone, unfortunately, as soon as GW would get wind of another project like it, it would probably be stopped.

But that doesn't mean you couldn't make such a project for yourself, and maybe share it privately with your friends...

Unfortunately, I don't currently have the time to participate. I'd love to. If some of my current plans pan out, I might have time after September this year.
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 5:44

Bear in mind a very good Space Hulk freeware project was killed off by Games Workshop not so long ago. I think it's a brilliant idea but wonder if the lawyers will get to it first.
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heylookitsmatt
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 6:37

Well, if someone wants to help, I'll keep making graphics. Unfortunately, I don't have any experience making 3D, so it would have to be X-com style. Perhaps something inspired by Mordheim? Something a bit more traditional with hit points and such? That would appease the lawyers and perhaps make it easier to code. I can make these things to order, so if someone has an idea, chances are I could draw it.
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 7:46

As it is, I am using already existing games to make a Mordheim setting to, instead of making a game from scratch: The Neverwinter Nights Aurora Engine Toolkit Editor. With a few hakpaks I have actually begun to get some really noce looking stuff together.

Maybe that would be a way to make a "quick" Mordheim experience on your computer??? The programming skills needed are low, so anyone can have a go at it, even me Smile
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heylookitsmatt
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 13:23

Sweet! Got any links to show?
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 16:42

I don't think I can help much, but just wanted to offer moral support and encouragement. FFT is one of my all time favorite games, so if you made Final-Mord-Tactics-Heim you'd be my new best friend. :3

Its stupidly ambitious, but if you could include a multiplayer element that we as a forum could use to play games over the net, that would be insanely epic.
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 17:15

heylookitsmatt wrote:
Perhaps something inspired by Mordheim? Something a bit more traditional with hit points and such?
This is really what I envisioned all along. I see no reason why a computer game has to play exactly the same as the board game, and recreate the setting as well. It's too redundant - why have the computer game at all?

No, I think you're onto the right track. Make a computer simulation of Mordheim the setting, not of Mordheim the game. Mordheim plays the way it does because it's designed to be played on a tabletop with pencils and dice. Computer games use different tools. Use the model of other successful tactical skirmish computer games to guide you.
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 17:39

Myntokk wrote:
heylookitsmatt wrote:
Perhaps something inspired by Mordheim? Something a bit more traditional with hit points and such?
This is really what I envisioned all along. I see no reason why a computer game has to play exactly the same as the board game, and recreate the setting as well. It's too redundant - why have the computer game at all?

No, I think you're onto the right track. Make a computer simulation of Mordheim the setting, not of Mordheim the game. Mordheim plays the way it does because it's designed to be played on a tabletop with pencils and dice. Computer games use different tools. Use the model of other successful tactical skirmish computer games to guide you.

I'll still need a programmer!
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 19:29

Hopefully someone will come forward for you soon, however, if no-one does, don't shelve everything. After September, I just may have the time...

::keeps fingers crossed::
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 22:25

heylookitsmatt wrote:
Sweet! Got any links to show?

Unfortunately no, not yet. I have some areas done (Southern Gatehouse mainly), and from there I have just begun work on equipment and NPC's etc. The great thing with this idea is that NWN can be run by a DM in multiplayer, so if you want, tou CAN roll dice to "simulate" the Mordheim system, and have the DM allocate damage and roll for "Knocked down", "Stunned" and "OOA", then applying the appropriate effect In Game Smile

Well see. If I do come up with anything, I'll make a my o wn thread and stop highjacking this one
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Sun 24 Jan 2010 - 22:27

heylookitsmatt wrote:
I'll still need a programmer!
Haha yes, that's true. Sorry I can't offer any skill or expertise in that arena.
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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Mon 25 Jan 2010 - 8:14

Another quick teaser. The crossbow is giving me some trouble. How about a new house rule: NO CROSSBOWS! heh heh.

Anyway, these guys are decked out in a gritty yellow/tan color and white. I'm probably going to start completely over on the backgrounds. I'm thinking they need to be very dark.


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PostSubject: Re: Mordheim Freeware Project   Mon 25 Jan 2010 - 10:53

Love the character models! I agree that darker is better for the environment.
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