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 Are the Undead horrible?

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ebon_tower
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PostSubject: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 1:30

So, the other night, the Ebon Tower Legion was retired. They died not with a bang, but with a wimper.

We've currently got a 7-player, 21 week campaign going on. It's kind of large in scope, sure, but it allows all players to play all other players 3 times. Each player also gets a bye-week for a total of 18 games / person. We've broken the campaign up into three rounds, each round featuring a game vs. every opponent - ie, you'll play every other player once in round 1, then again in round 2, and again in the final set of games for round 3.

We're about half way through the campaign, just finishing up week 3 of round 2, and I can tolerate my warband no longer.

I started off great - Full compliment of heros, 2 ghouls, and 8 zombies to fill out the ranks cheap and easy. Maybe this was a mistake, not taking 4 ghouls, but I was young and untempered. (and if that WAS the mistake that crippled my warband, it only proves the point I'm building up to make - more on that in a moment.) Anyway, I went all of round 1 undefeated! I won every single game, although quite a few, especially the last few, I bled horribly for. In that first round, i lost 2 of my 3 dregs, just as they were starting to get some stats worth keeping them around for... they just seemed so fragile compared to everyone else's heroes. Likewise, my necromancer served only to be a zombie-reanimating machine, as that was the only spell I could get on him, and failed utterly to get anything else useful out of him. Basically, my warband was being propped up on my Vampire and my handful of ghouls that I was slowly swapping my zombies for as I had money to do so.

However, as this first round (6 games in 7 weeks) went by, I started to notice something happening - My warband rating was slowly gaining 5 or 6 points every game, while every one else was quickly overtaking me. I was the only "undefeated" player by the end of round 1, but nearly everyone else had a higher warband rating. Indeed, only 2 players were behind me, neither by much, and they had NOT won every game. In fact, between the two of them, there was only ONE victory to be claimed. Not only that, but one had lost their leader, and another had seen a series of crippling injuries that kept his warband from growing into anything frightening until very recently. I was nearly getting underdog XP from the highest warband in our group.

Then, when round 2 started, it all began to crumble for me. The other warbands had simply overtaken me, and it seemed like EVERYONE had better stats than everyone in my warband, including my vampire! Heck, a couple of the possessed in our campaign were nearly juggernauts, unable to be killed, and dishing out 4 or 5 attacks at S4 or 5, while my vampire remained at 2 S5 attacks with her halberd. Even dual-wielding with her wouldn't have gotten her up to the level of ouch these other models were putting out. I was not only defeated in every game so far in round 2, but I've been HUMIILIATED thus far.

To make matters worse, about game 4 or 5 of round 1, our Skaven player had her warband wiped out utterly. A series of bad rolls on her part, good rolls on her opponent's part, and some horrible after-action rolls led to her taking irrecoverable losses, and needing to restart her warband...

She is now the highest warband rating in our campaign.

So, I decided I was going to retire my warband - this after getting underdog experience from my opponent and having 5 different Ghoul groups level up, and not getting a SINGLE Lad's Got Talent roll, so I'm still stuck with 2 dregs and a gimpy necromancer, plus a Vampire that's holding her own. The Skaven player was my next scheduled opponent, so she and everyone else agreed, we would play our game (at this point she has over +75 WBR on me, so I'm getting +2xp per model) and if it turned out well, and I decided not to retire them, it would count... but if it didn't go well, we would call the game a "practice" to make sure I wanted to retire them, and we'd play "officially" with whatever warband I chose to replace my current one with next week... at the increased XP modifier to get my heros up to pace quicker.

She DESTROYED me. Even with 4 games less experience than me, my VAMPIRE was outmatched by no fewer than 3 of her guys, with a few others coming quickly up behind. Once she passed a fear check to be able to charge my vampire, it was all over.

I can't help but feel, though, that I wasn't defeated by my opponents as much as I was hamstrung by the warband itself and how it relates to the rules around it. My warband died a slow death because of limited options, the worst "heroes" in the game, and ghouls that cost 40gc to do what a verminkin can basically do with 22gc, with the notable exception of causing fear.

Does anyone else feel this way? Are the Undead just unplayably broken?
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 4:40

The worst heroes in the game? If you look up the vampire max-stats, and take into account the starting stats and special rules, it is the single BEST warrior in the game. Also, having a spellcaster as a hero choice is great! And yeah, the dreggs are pretty weak, but since they have no starting Xp, you can level them up pretty fast and mold them to the heroes of your liking (I am going to make one of my dreggs a Frankensteins monster!).

The weaknesses I spot here is mainly too much reliance on zombies. I'd go with no more than 5. Then take two extra ghouls. Also, Dire Wolves from the start is a good idea, even if it is just one. Replace a zombie if you have too many warriors. I'd also avoid making many different groups with ghouls, as you will get several PRETTY strong henchmen, instead of getting equally as many STRONG henchmen.

What i mean is, that when splitting warriors into many groups, some of them are bound to level faster, as at least one of three henchmen groups will go unharmed after a battle and thus gain experience. While a single large henchmen group, on the other hand, will have a greater chance of losses, and thus be Xp hampered, but when they level up, you get four or five level ups at the same time!

Also, yourspellcaster should be given Arcane Knowledge if you cant get any Necromatic spells, as the Lesser Magic spells can be really good (Silver Arrows of Arha, Sword of Rezhebel and Fire of Uzhul, great!). If you get Re-Animation, you could afford to switch a zombie for anotehr wolf or ghoul, as you can make the zombies re-animate if you happen to loose one, not making them as important as other troops anymore.

Also, it sounds like a big deal of bad luck on your part, as Skaven are not often supposed to pass Ld tests to that extent. One or maybe two, out of three, even under the Leader skill, so your vampire being swamped by rats sounds like bad luck... ?

I am putting together yet another Undead Warband soon, and I am sad to hear you are abandoning them. What warband will you replace them with?
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 5:21

yes the core rules are unbalanced

zombies should be able to run
(otherwise they just suck too much)
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 5:42

I never understood that part, why shouldn't a zombie be aloud to run, after all it can charge as others. Fluff issue? nah, then they shouldn't be able to charge either, just slowly walk onto the enemy..
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 6:24

I like it. They are lumbering corpses, and the fact that the do not run is, IMO, because they are slow to react, and therefore, running without a specific cause isn't really something a Zombie would do. BUT, if he can pick up the scent of braaaiiiins, and see his lunch (*ahem* victim) he has a reason to lumber on in a higher speed. To me, it is perfectly clear.

And I do not think that the Undead are unbalanced either. There are several ways of coping with the zombies lack of speed. besides, they are the only ones who move slow in the warband! Dire may not be able to run, but they still walk damn fast (9", thats 1" more than a running human). I mean, dwarves move 1" LESS than a zombie, and therefore runs only 2" faster.

Besides, the Vampires Move of 6" (12" running), and the dire wolves 9" Move, and ghouls, Dreggs and Necromancer at normal speeds, actually balances out the lowly zombies. Also, as Zombies are immune to psycjhology, poisons and being stunned, the price 15gc makes them good despite being slow.
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 6:41

I guess i have to enhance my zombies in my alchemy cult warband with some wyrdstone power and add a few gc to make them run
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 9:21

I actually made an interesting zombie with my custom Necrarch Warband. One of his experiments was a henchmen called a Whipstitched Zombie, like a zombie experiment with some augments, like an extra arm or leg or even two or three heads. They had normal zombie stats, but the group would, at creation, roll on an augmenting and atrophy tables.

Sorta like this:

Augments
1-2: Extra Head - The zombie has an extra W.
3-4: Extra Arm - The zombie has an extra A.
5-6: Extra Leg - The zombie has two extra M.

Atrophies
1-2: Weak Joints - The zombie has -1 S
3-4: Bad stitches - The zombie has -1 T
5-6: Rotten Bones - The zombie is taken OOA on a 4-6 rather than a 5-6.

Of course, these choices and lists were more advanced, but I dont remember it all.

Also, there was the choice of paying to roll on these tables again in the post-battle sequense, as the Necrarch would try to imrpove his mad experiments.

Haha, i remember another henchman in that warband, the floating heads. Heads empowered with dark magic that floated around, biting people. Now, their REAL use was if the Necrach got some spell that exploded the heads, destroying them permanently, but also dealing large amounts of damage to anyone nearby. Hmm, maybe it is time to re-invent thisold idea!
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 10:10

Ebon I think it all comes down to luck. Example:

-I had a Undead warband, Vamp x2 swords (hvy armor, yeah yeahg i know but it actually helped)

-Necromancer (club and bow, because he got crappy spell)

-3 dregs (bows and clubs)

-and as many ghouls as possible

-And a warlock to have extra fire power (silver arrows FTW!)

I played agains dwarves and had great success as my dregs and necromancer provided suppressive fire, my vamp quickly took out their heroes and ghouls / vamp swarmed the gromril wearing dwarf lord. WIN

Minor upgrades, I got the SPELL O DOOOOOOM!!! For my necro.. he got to cast it once.. ever! And i got a dwarf zombie some how, more to come with this great arieal zomie to come!

Next game verse skavin. A good game, with the slings vs bow (my guys sucked at shooting btw) the necro was takin ooa (but got horrible scars out of it ) And my vamp captured the assasin with his weeping blades and was able to get wpn training! Thats right a vamp with weeping blades! ANd a new skavin zombie Smile

A couple of games pass where I was winning till the return of skavin and revenge of the dwarves! My roster was full, a godling of a vamp with weeping blades a few trinkets, and just vicious fangs! , a great amount of ghouls and 2 zombies for fluff (one skavin and one dwarf). And it happens that on this day that the dwarves and skavin put aside their differences and take out a common enemy that plagues them both.... the ever victoroius/ goreious undead! And they did, with awesome rolls the dwarves took my vamp to one wound ( he had 3 at the start of this game and a high toughness) then after routing the dwarfs with ghoul/ vamp combo the sneaky skavin, who I had forgotten about flanked my dregs necromancer and reminded me that they have a Rat-troll! So I rush to save my other heroes (they are worth more i staying alive to me than undead haha). And then the war began, the vamp swiftly took a wound on the troll, being cautious was long gone and then remembered he only had a single wound left! The rat ogre made short work of him with good rolls and yes passing the lds test >8(

But the best part is all the leaders were taken out, the skavin was taken out by the best way ever! While fighting on the ground floor, the only way to help my necro from being swarmed was to have the zombie dwarf do a diving charge! And sure enough the zombie save the day by taking out the rat king!

So, Ebon what was the moral of this story? Get yourself a lucky rabbits foot, and if that doesnt work u can always throw it at your oppenent! And have fun!

AND take lots of ghouls!

-Fungo
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 10:34

Opheliate wrote:
The worst heroes in the game? If you look up the vampire max-stats, and take into account the starting stats and special rules, it is the single BEST warrior in the game.

Yeah. I think that too!

Most people think that dire wolves are crap (too expensive, no advances), but a pair for a starting warband solves pretty much the "speed" issue.

You just don't replace them when they are killed, and use money to buy better warriors (but I for myself will try to have at least one in my warband all the time for the speed factor).

Dregs are pretty much EXACTLY EQUAL to any mercenaries youngblood (actually have better Ld, but costs 5 gc more) so I think you just had bad luck with them, as they SHOULD advance at pretty much the same rate that any youngblood.

As has been said, dregs start with zero experience, and with just a bit of luck, they can make their first advance roll after the first game.

As you have said YOU WON ALL your initial games, so it's not a warband fault or unbalance imo. Seems more like a big lack of luck in the after battle sequence: Not enough money earned, doubles or treebles rolled, advances, etc., but in our games Undead warbands tend to work fairly balanced with the others.

But then, that's just my opinion.

Best wishes.
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 12:46

Good lord, I read the first post and then read some rant of running zombies.
But I'm fine now. really.

The zombies are fine, they are immune to psychology and makes people pee their pants.

As if that wasn't enough they disrupt charges, block the LOS to your necro and they make people unwittingly crash into your blitzing vampire who hopefully have relatively speedy bodyguards to add that thump in the charge.

Dire wolves speed things up a bit but should be used sparingly as a second blitz flank (if the money is tight) unlike dregs who are replaceable thinking skillgaining meat best kept somewhere centerfield relatively close to your important necro.

Use the terrain and do remind yourself and the opponents of the psych rulings, these are important in any and all GW game.

There are multiple uses for zombies, they excel at squatting and speedbumping. They are free and/or cheap. they disrupt any enemy activity by any who is dumb enough to get close.

If you have the dosh get an ogre if your impatient for the hurting to get started.
(that reminds me, even though hes beardy he can be surrounded by god know what in any number of constallation. a zombie under the direction of a man who cal talk to dice can keep four enemies busy for a long time, or force four unsuspecting youngbloods to into a wild stampede)

there is no universal fix for a warband in a single trooptype, leave that to the weakfleshed humans!
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 13:45

My problems aren't with Zombies or the Vampire. I'm actually quite happy with both of them. My main greivances are:

- Ghouls are the only hench type that earns experience, so if you want heroes, you're stuck with them.

- Ghouls actually aren't that great in comparison, for their cost. Yes, they're T4 and cause fear, and that makes them resilient, and that's great. But for 22gc, I can get a verminkin with nearly the same stats, sans the fear, dual wielding daggers, that has nearly the same combat effectiveness as the ghoul (at +1WS, also) I feel like I'm paying a premium for a henchman that's only decent.

- Necromancers have few useful spells, so tend to just stand around wasting a hero slot instead of being useful. They require quite a few level-ups (and subsequently rolling NEW SKILL instead of junk stats) to MAKE them useful instead of being useful "out of the box."

- Same story with Dregs, only doubly so. Yes, they have roughly the same stats as a Youngblood - but the Youngblood is surrounded by other reliable units, and I feel that forcing us to make the MAJORITY of our heroes YB-equivalent models, backed up by a moderately useful Necromancer and a very good Vampire isn't the basis for a strong warband. Basically, if you don't get JUST the right skill-ups and keep the dregs out of combat, your warband cannot prosper.

- All in all, I find that if even SOME of your rolls don't go your way, this warband cannot succeed. It's horribly unforgiving. You cannot build a warband off of one awesome model and a few sorta-good models. My vampire cannot solo entire warbands.
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 13:51

How about

Vampire Skill

Sparkle
The Vampire sparkles in the sunlight, everyone is so taken back by the prettyness that they cannot attack them. Any female human mercenary youngbloods or Sister of Sigmar novices must pass a leadership test or they will leave their current warband and join the undead warband, but must remain with 2" of the Vampire at all times.












Sorry
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 15:19

Mortimer wrote:
How about

Vampire Skill

Sparkle
The Vampire sparkles in the sunlight, everyone is so taken back by the prettyness that they cannot attack them. Any female human mercenary youngbloods or Sister of Sigmar novices must pass a leadership test or they will leave their current warband and join the undead warband, but must remain with 2" of the Vampire at all times.

*facepalm*

I'm ashamed to have laughed at this.

Has anybody seen my dignity?
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 15:38

Razz it might just be that your tactical sensibilities are more vermin oriented.
If its the fact that rats kick your ass alot then focus on keeping the ghouls where the action is,near the vampire.
Cause fear goes a long way against most things (sans deamons and undead Razz) okay mortal things.
they're cheaper long haul teef'n'nails troopers than the direwolves,
and keeping them near the vampire creates a sweeping XP harvesting killzone thats slowly secured by the necro and the zombies to prevent the enemy from creeping back on the board.

The necro is very useful albeit his role isnt as active,
the big issue often seen is usually with people leaving him high and dry infront of the zombies where he doesnt do any good,
he fills a support role and as such should be the one providing reenforcements to your tide of dead flesh if you have psych resilient enemies who by any and all cost try to stay on the board,
the dregs provide safer postbattle rolls and does a good deal of herding.


(it's useful to think of the legends written by the developers as they're drenched in tactica,
'first there was the vampire and/or the mighty big necro then there was the hordes and hordes of rotting flesh' Razz)

There's alot of babysitting with a new undead warband as you say,
and it takes a spot of time for them to do the work on autopilot.
But its still your vampire and necros first campaign
and they havent amassed Mannfred level magics yet BUT SOON....SOON.
(then you shake your fist at your sworn enemies the feeders of decaying matter!!)
then just do an evil laugh befitting your personality (don't giggle, chicks dig it but not on the battlefield...I've heard. )


@Mortimer: So we've not only quit learning the rules and invent rules to win,
rather than to get more stuff and see new places but we're having pretty looking daywalkers now?
cute liches?
petite angelic and porcelain skinned dwarves?
pweedy fwuzzy kwaos bwejsejker pussycats?

Okay I want a count, how many are aware that this game has been around
for oh a rough decade? that this is a game thats finished and not a hypothetical one?
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 15:54

Joke man


And some of us enjoy tweaking things, creating new rules and everything ... Mordheim ain't perfect after all ... and neither are us perfectionists.
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 17:33

undead are ok balanced (neigther over- or underpowered) but you need to play them in a different way than the list was intended

* only use zombies to bring warband cap to max
* keep all heroes alive to ensure max income
* buy ghouls and dire wolves, then fight with those

boring but not underpowered, at least

for an alternative take on undead, allow them to hire dregs as henchmen as well and alllow zombies to run Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sat 12 Dec 2009 - 20:36

I've had some success in two campaigns playing without Zombies, instead just using Ghouls and Dire Wolves. Before I tried that combo, I was just as frustrated with the middle- and late-game performance of the Undead as Ebon Tower - this from multiple campaigns over many years.

I've found maneuverability to be one of the keys to winning scenarios, so that's why I finally dropped the Zombies. Now, if my Necro developed into a Zombie support wizard, I'd reconsider that stance, but it hasn't happened in these last two campaigns.

Not having to buy equipment for henchmen means I'm not so worried about using the money on my henchmen instead. The Ghouls are my front-runners, the Heroes are right behind, and the Dire Wolves are my deep chargers. I do get the Vamp/Necro/Dregs bows for some basic missile fire flexibility - not having it has proved disastrous. Another key is knowig just how far to push with the Vampire - you can't hold him back, but you can't let him get cut off from support and surrounded.

Even so, I'm now tired of this cookier-cutter band, so we're adding flexibility to the Undead for our next campaign. We're including Skeletons, and a Wight as a Hired Sword, along with a few other tweaks (in addition to what we've done already).
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sun 13 Dec 2009 - 0:08

MonkeyShaman wrote:
Good lord, I read the first post and then read some rant of running zombies.
But I'm fine now. really.

Hey! Hurt my feelings... i'll make you watch the Twilight movies, I swear!
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sun 13 Dec 2009 - 4:43

@Mort: creativity is fine, you feel free to declare your vampire as pretty, or A vampire or multiples.
Overall theres been a lot of stuff in that (spechul rool:I winz7!1) flavour and we dont need to reinvent the game for every person who hasnt taken their time to get to know their warband.
Making up new stuff and scenarios with accepted rules to shake things up and to enable building over maxstat levels is fine but that might take a while and the stuff available will hold you over for some time.


@Opheliate: I hurt your feelings by vaguely insinuating a dislike for running zombies?
And I'm fairly certain that watching Twilight is illegal here in Sweden, goes under the paragraph "stuff you wouldnt do even if you were ever so slightly perverted and/or for the purpose of being ironic."
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sun 13 Dec 2009 - 5:13

MonkeyShaman wrote:

@Opheliate: I hurt your feelings by vaguely insinuating a dislike for running zombies?
And I'm fairly certain that watching Twilight is illegal here in Sweden, goes under the paragraph "stuff you wouldnt do even if you were ever so slightly perverted and/or for the purpose of being ironic."

Oh, i thought you were, in a very suptle way, having a go at my ranting. I am with you, i dislike running zombies. At least the undead ones! Zombies as in infected, still-living ones, as seen in 28 Days Later or the celebrated computer game Left 4 Dead and its sequal, Left 4 Dead 2. Those can, and should, IMO, run.

Also, the joke someone did about a glittering vampire is, in fact, from the Twilight movie, as Edward the ridiculously handsome (at least the girls claim so) vampire, is going to reveal how he looks in the sunlight. You get ready to see a horror emerge, as they have built up the suspense during the whole scene. Picture Cthulu and Sam the Dog. He steps into the sunlight, I get ready to scream and... and... and he starts to glitter. Golden glittery skin. Once again: The one horrific and scary thing this guy can do, is, at most, irritate your eyes in bright sunlight.

Oh, I guess I broke a law by seeing it... hm... how about I saw it to get my gf to stop begging me to see it with her... and get some, too... ?
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sun 13 Dec 2009 - 5:32

Quote :
Oh, I guess I broke a law by seeing it... hm...
how about I saw it to get my gf to stop begging me to see it with
her... and get some, too... ?

As that rule applies to being forcefed the sex and the city shoebox
over and over and over again just because you have a functioning DVD player...
anywhere
I think its admissable as an excempt from it.

enough off topic I think ebon wants his thread back Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sun 13 Dec 2009 - 8:05

Haha, yeah, sorry Ebon Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sun 13 Dec 2009 - 15:05

It's cool. I've gotten the input I need, I think. The answer I'm gleaning is, "Yes, the undead take some babysitting, but they're by no means BAD. If your post game rolls suck as much as yours did, any warband - undead or not - would fail."

That said, I've found an elegant solution (I think) to my problem. I'm a lore/fluff monkey, and I like for my warband to have a story so I've done this:

-------
Baroness Cyndane, having watched her warband fail to develop, and needing to do SOMETHING, lest the Von Carsteins get angry with her lack of delivery, reviews her options. Back in Sylvania, Cyndane had an... ally would be the closest word, but in a province of undead nobles all backstabbing one another in an eternal power struggle, "ally" is always a stretch. That said, where trust could be found, this particular Stregoi vampire came closest to it.

"Pack up, Valaquin," she ordered her bookish necromancer. "Dismiss the undead slaves. We need to move quickly."

"Of course, M'lady," he answered, slightly apprehensive and confused. "Where are we going?"

Cyndane stared off to the horizon, toward Sylvania. "To burn a bridge, Valaquin. To burn a bridge."

* * * * *

The doors were opened wide for her, as she knew they would be. The Stregoi's manservant, Otto, welcomed her and her warband into the keep as he had done a dozen times before. This time, he would find shortly, would be different.

The Baroness smiled broadly, a big toothy smile, as the master of the house came to welcome her. Her three servants - Wilhelm, tall and strong; Zigfried, wild-eyed; and Helmüt, limping slightly - stood behind her, dressed as well as three of the lowest dregs of society could be.

"Karl!" she cood as the Stregoi approached. "Such a delight to see you once more! I trust your estate has been safe and strong?"

The Stregoi grinned back to her uncertainly, not quite knowing what to make of her visit to his home. She had her retinue with her, and that in itself suggested aggression, but her demeanor suggested otherwise. "Strong as ever, Baroness Nightshade. And yours? I had heard you had ventured to Mordheim... How fares that expedition, hm?"

Cyndane was not known for her patience, and this charade had gone on just long enough. "It's strange you should ask, Karl. It is for that precise reason I am here." She drew her sword with lightning alacrity. "SEIZE HIM!" she bellowed.

Helmüt lunged at Otto and overpowered him immediately. The manservant was simply too shocked to act. The Stregoi, however, was not so flat-footed, and leveled his dreadful gaze on the two dregs, stopping them in their tracks. Cyndane leaped at him, slashing vigorously with her sword, but finding no purchase in the Stregoi's thick beastial skin and powerful but agile movements.

As the guards began to mobilize, the ghouls began their dark work, dropping from ceilings, ambushing from around corners, and charging in over the walls, killing and feasting upon those they slew. Not a single guard made it to their master's side.

Zigfried and Wilhelm recovered their wits, and came to their Mistress' aid, finally subduing the Stregoi vampire. Standing over his broken body, Cyndane bellowed for her necromancer to attend her.

"I am here, Mistress," he said meekly. For a student of the dark arts, he seemed hardly at place in such a macabre setting - Cyndane thought at this moment he would be far more comfortable in the halls of the Bright College.

"Upstairs," she instructed, "you will find a great library of dark and arcane rights. The Stregoi are powerful and beastial, and I wish to find a way to add their power to our own. Go now, and do not fail me."

Valaquin Dalasander only blinked at her for a few seconds, trying to digest the weight of what he was just instructed to do. "I ... I would not presume to know what you seek, Baroness... I..."

The vampire's gaze softened, conveying the desperation of HER situation to the soft-hearted necromancer. "Valaquin Dalasander, this Stregoi will recover from his wounds very quickly. If you have not found SOMETHING by the time he does, we may not have a second chance to subdue him, and it will mean the end of ALL of us. As I cannot decipher the arcane, this task falls to you, my bookish servant! If I did not belive you up to the task, we would not have risked such a gambit!"

"Baroness... I..."

"Go now," She punctuated.

"Yes Mistress." And with that, the small man was off, up the winding spiral staircase behind him.

* * * * *

The ritual was simple, really; A piece of your spirit would be sacrificed to grant you the 'aspect of the beast,' whatever that meant. The writings were very sketchy on EXACTLY what beastial aspect would be gained, or how much a "piece" of your spirit was, or what exactly losing a piece of your spirit meant... but it was the most potent ritual Valaquin could find on such short notice, and it called for the blood of the subdued Stregoi to complete it, so it killed - if you'll pardon the pun - two birds with one stone.

After the dark rite was completed, the effects were noticeable and immediate. All were filled with speed and agility unlike any they had experienced before, but they felt skittish and on-edge. Even the ghouls seemed more frightened than frightening. Cyndane herself seemed to have lost the most in the ritual... her movements were fluid as ever, but she had definitely lost her aura of menace that all vampires seemed to carry with them.

They were all changed, henceforth, but would try to use their new found power to their best advantage.

---------------

Long story short - I'm using my same models, but playing skaven!

Cyndane - Assassin Adept
Valaquin - Eshin Sorcerer
Dregs - Night Runners, Black Skaven
Ghouls - Verminkin
Zombies - Giant Rats

I hated to see a nicely painted and modeled army go to waste! Plus, cash is tight and I didn't want to spend extra money on models I couldn't afford, so this is what I came up with.
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sun 13 Dec 2009 - 17:32

I would point out that with reasonable dual-wield house rules, ghouls become a lot more competitive (I use -1 to hit on both attacks if dual wielding).
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PostSubject: Re: Are the Undead horrible?   Sun 13 Dec 2009 - 23:21

Great backstory! Haha, I can really see it working, no matter how strange it sounds Smile
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