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Wolfen
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PostSubject: Bloodline Rules   Sat 1 Aug 2009 - 14:35

I have searched many places and cant find anything on this. Has anyone written Vampire Bloodline power rules? I know with the new vampire army book they redid the bloodlines but I would love to see some Blood Dragons, Strigoi etc roaming the streets of Mordheim.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Sat 1 Aug 2009 - 15:07

There is nothing official for different bloodlines. There have been many attempts at creating "fan" made rules but I have not seen anything complete on them.

Hopefully, someone else has come across some good material and pass it on.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Sat 1 Aug 2009 - 15:24

Necrarchs, the Soul Stealers done by Bram or appeared in Letters of the Damned. I enjoyed playing them. They were mediocore for quite awhile and then the little vampire got his first spell and then...
Strigoi appear in one of the Dwarfen realm underground settings.
The Lahmians have a warband in the Khemri, Land of the Dead setting.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Sat 1 Aug 2009 - 18:59

It's never tested, but here was the bloodline rules I created for a 'Devil's Den' challenge. They use the same rules as the Undead Warband, with the following adjustments to Skills and bonus/penalties. They are like the Merc types (Reik/Midden/Marienburg), and are chosen at the warband's creation.

VON CARLSTEIN - (same as existing undead warband)
Vampire - comb / acad / strength / speed
necro - academic / speed
dreg - comb / strength


LAHMIAN
Vampire - comb / shoot / acad / speed
necro - academic / speed
dreg - comb / shoot/ speed
Pro: Vamp Starts off with the Chaos Ritual Spell "Lure of Chaos". May not learn any other spells, unless she learns "Arcane Lore" and owns a tome of magic. All Heroes start with +1 Initiative.
Con: All Ghouls suffer from Animosity (see the Orc Warband). You may have no more than 2 Ghoul Heroes (though they may choose 'Strength' as a skill list choice, and lose the Animosity disadvantage upon promotion.)

BLOOD DRAGON
Vampire - comb / strength / speed
necro - academic / strength
dreg - comb / strength
All Vampires and Dregs start with +1 WS. Also, the Vampire starts with the Riding skill "Ride Nightmare". At warband formation, you may purchase a Nightmare for the leader for 95gc.
All Dire Wolves are at -1 Movement.

STRIGOI
Vampire - comb / strength / speed
necro - combat / speed
dreg - comb / strength/ speed
The Vampire starts at Strength 5. Dregs start with Strength 4. Also, the Max Strength of Ghouls is raised to 5.
Strigoi warband cannot hire Dire Wolves nor use missile weapons. No models in your warband may ride a mount.


(new one, just trying it out.)

NECRARCH
Vampire - comb / acad / speed
necro - academic / speed
dreg - comb / strength

The vampire starts with -1 Strength, but starts with a spell from the Necromancy spell list, and may learn spells from the Necromancy spell list, or from the 'Dark Elves' magic list. All Zombies have +1 Movement.
At the start of the game, the number of ghouls placed on a battle field cannot be greater than the number of zombies and dire wolves you place combined (ex. if your warband has 5 ghouls, your zombies and dire wolves must total 5 or more). If you cannot, the excess ghouls may not be placed on the board this game, and must sit out (if other members of the same henchmen group are placed, the entire group gains experience.)
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Sun 2 Aug 2009 - 2:56

Seems fun, though a bit to many special rules for each – maybe simplify it slightl
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Sun 2 Aug 2009 - 10:51

How's this for a simpler version? (Still uses the skill lists from above)

Lahmian - All heroes have +1 Initiative. Vampire starts with 'Lure' spell. Allowed only 0-5 ghouls (they may learn strength when they advance.)

Blood Dragon - All heroes have +1 WS. Vampire starts with Ride 'Nightmare' skill and may buy one at start up. Number of dire wolves become 0-3.

Strigoi - Vampire & Dregs start with +1 Strength. No model in the warband may use missiles, ride, or wear armor.

Necrarch - The Vampire starts with -1 Strength and two Necromancy spells, plus Wizard ability. Remove Necromancer, but may instead hire 0-4 Dregs.

(Note: when I say 'all heroes', I mean Vampire, necromancer, and dregs. Not promoted henchmen.)
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Sun 2 Aug 2009 - 20:25

this got me thinking, i always thought that dregs were bad heroes, so how would you up them?

they have combat and strength. giving them a 3rd skill list would be a good way to fix them, but neigther shooting, academic or speed would fit with the warband

then there's the question of giving them stat increases. this does not seem viable eigther

or the option of giving them a starting skill, like merc swordsmen have the expert swordsman skill, only there are no suitable skills

then there is the option of making them immune to fear (they have seen corpses so many times anyway) - this seems the best solution, imo, but still pretty bland

my best dreg fix is thus:

0-3 dregs 20gc
0 xp
combat, stregnth
4 2 2 3 3 1 3 1 6(!)
Immune to fear


any feedback on this?
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Sun 2 Aug 2009 - 20:38

Hmm. Well, I like the idea of a grave-robbing forte. This could equal 'Streetwise', Haggle or 'Wyrdstonehunter', but how about this:

Bodysnatcher: Any dreg that survived the game without being taken out of action and did not search for a rare item may attempt to snatch a body. Roll 2D6, as if you are looking for a rare item (adding 'rarity' modifiers as normal.) On a result of 8 or higher, your Dreg has found a body, which immediately becomes a Zombie in your warband's employ, added to your roster at no cost.
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conan the ballbearing
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Mon 3 Aug 2009 - 0:57

i remember reading somewhere of some one creating a rule wherebye the vampire can create lesser vampires or thralls from his dregs, this would give them a much needed boost to their stats as they are rather poor quality heros to start with. i've never play tested this idea myself and it may may the warband too powerful in the long run, but it has some merrit to start with
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Wed 5 Aug 2009 - 10:11

not sure if it's any help but the web site ofr the lesser vampires is killershrike.com. they have got some very interesting additions to Mordheim on the site. I'd put a link in this post but being computer illiterate as i am i haven't got a clue how to
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Wed 5 Aug 2009 - 20:05

I have only second hand experience to go by, but for most people I've played with, the dregs are only place fillers until the player can promote 4 ghouls. After that, they're unceremoniously kicked out, and the true might of the undead comes into play as you're rushed by super-tough heroes with many attacks.

As for killer shrike, I haven't had the pleasure to play most of his stuff, but on paper, some of his stuff is really neat, and other parts look game-breakingly-broken. I do know for a fact that one player in our group used his 'Vampire Slayers' warband, and they were lots of fun. (It's basically a Witch Hunter warband without flaggelants and weaker dogs, but with vampire slaying equipment and 0-1 Dhampire heroes... startswith M5, S4, T4, and max Vampire stats. Like I said, lots of fun.) And to be fair to Shrike and Boss Umbuk, I used their Silver Bullets for Sartosa, so perhaps it's wrong of me to speak ill of them.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 6:52

Dregs.
This is one of those internet things that I find annoying. I've run a campaign for 8 yrs at the same store with dozens of players over the years. No one has ever dropped a dreg for a ghoul. I don't know that anyone has thought of it.

But they will now, because its best practice. The internet says so... Grumble, new fangled..., why in my day...
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 7:07

Well, this was also a 500 point warband, led by a maxed out vampire with S7, wielding a double-handed gromril weapon... nothing like a -7 on armor save.

That was the worst occurance, but not the only one. Trust me, a Ghoul with Weapons Training, a double handed weapon, and strongman can be pretty fierce.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 7:15

Time to start enforcing no equipment for ghouls.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 8:20

A maxed out ghoul/ghast is pretty mean without weapons training, take as many of the strength and speed skills as you can and just with his bare hands and teeth he is nigh on unstoppable, i know as i have one, o.k i haven't used him for some years in a campaign(i think i might be so sad as to start up a solo campaign soon)and reaper do some very good ghast minis too
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 10:01

Oh! Again with the different games with the same name thing!
We go by Toumas's "no equipment means no equipment" rule. (Except for Lucky Charms, Smile ) So the Ghoul hero is a bare-handed combat master, but he will never have a weapon.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 10:06

Quote :
Time to start enforcing no equipment for ghouls.

Add this:

Weapons: Ghoul heroes that learn to use weapons through the ‘Weapons Training’ skill suffer -1 Attack on profile while doing so. (Shields are Armour and can never be used by Ghouls.)

And everyone's happy Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 10:21

Any attempt to give Ghouls a weapon is a house rule. Which is fine if your gaming group likes that.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 10:25

Mordheim was made to be flexable and some people don't like the idea of a weaponless hero like a ghoul, so if their house rule allows it then why not, but there is nothing so satisfying as a bare handed blood crazed ghast ripping through the enemy it's eyes filled with hunger as shreds them limb from limb quenching it's thirst for human flesh in a savage beastial whirlwind of carnage
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 11:28

That ruling was made by my group years before I joined, so no use fighting it just cause I lost. I'm just glad that the POSSESSED can't get weapons. That would be just ridiculous.

To make the thread cicular, that's another reason why all of the Bloodlines I propose have a drawback as well... in my mind, the Undead Warband is not so weak that it needs additional strengths added on without any penalties to counterbalance them. That goes for dregs too.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Thu 6 Aug 2009 - 21:58

The house rule for Ghoul Equipment is cool with me. I just get jogged in rules discussions when house rules get in the mix. No big.

On topic. I like the idea of blood lines working like the mercenaries different rules for the same list, but I also like the various bloodline specific lists I listed above because they add henchmen and skills that are more "in keeping" with the bloodlines.
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Fri 7 Aug 2009 - 6:42

I never knew that the Khemri setting had more warbands added on to it. That's really neat. As for the Lahmia list, I normally have a pet-peeve about 5 different hero types, but the promotion system is clever. The Blood Sister seems underpriced by 5gc, though, and the Wights are too cheap by 5-10gc.

Strigoi - The warband itself looks really balanced, but the vampire has the ability to cast spells (which does cost him an extra 15gc, a good price), and purchase mutations in the Exploration phase instead of looking for items. The last part seems a bit too strong to me... maybe make it so he can purchase them instead of a skill?

I haven't played the LoD Necrarchs, but it looked really neat... that and it features the 'Abomination' which I worked into a scenario.

Oh, and the Moussilin or Moullsen sight has a Blood dragon list, I think.

[Note: purely speculation, have not played.]
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Fri 7 Aug 2009 - 7:13

On a side note, where can I find the warbands that were added to the Khemri Setting?
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Fri 7 Aug 2009 - 10:06

Just type in Khemri Mordheim in a search engine and it should pop up. There are some other ones that did not make the Town Cryer for a few different reasons.

Oh, ok, here it is....look below.

http://grafixgibs.tripod.com/Khemri/index.htm
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PostSubject: Re: Bloodline Rules   Today at 5:16

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