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 Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)

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Polar Star
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 6:09

We play where models can climb in situations such as examples C and D. We figured it would represent them jumping, grabbing the lip and hoisting themselves up. I also like it this way in terms of gameplay. Exciting things generally happen when people are climbing on top of stuff. We might be doing it wrong, but I think it works nicely in terms of gameplay.
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 6:14

Thanks Polar Star! We ended up deciding that any character can jump and climb up to half their movement characteristic (Poor Dwarves) This meant that they can climb up cool lips that aren't too far away but can't do anything crazy like climb two stories high.
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 6:41

We've always played that you could climb up that way. Otherwise it's really hard to find any good surfaces to climb.

On a side note, does anyone else find that having to end your turn next to a wall and THEN climb the next turn is a bit limiting? We've been thinking about allowing anyone to climb at any time as long as they have the movement for it.
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 12:40

very inspirational! i i might houserule it!
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 13:25

Yeah the way we usually play is that as long as you can move to "said climbable structure" and still have enough movement to make it to a platform. (either sheer 1 tall surface equal to movement (picture A/B) or a smaller climb (picture C/D)

As long as you make a Ini test per 2" of climbing.

Not wait a whole turn at the base to decide if you want to climb, if you have a skill to sheer surfaces id say it take 2' of movment regardless of height to account for the climb but being adept at climbing lessens the movement it requires... Just a thought...


(From personal experience I was climbing a 6" tower with my skaven to snipe with my slings, passed the first 2 Ini tests for the first 4" and failed on my third test, which ended up being 3 str 6 hits... all and all if I recall correctly I had 2 rats the fell and "broke thier necks" [OOA] before anyone was in CC.)
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 14:14

The rules allow you to climb up as long as you are touching the particular building, pass an initiative test and you have distance to climb. If you have all three then the model can climb accordingly.
climbing
Often the ruined buildings of Mordheim do not have
stairs or ladders, so your warriors will have to climb
to reach the upper floors of buildings.
Any model (except animals!) can climb up or down
fences, walls, etc. He must be touching what he wants
to climb at the start of his movement phase. He may
climb up to his total Movement in a single movement
phase (but cannot run while he is climbing). Any
remaining movement can be used as normal. If the
height is more than the modelís normal move, he
cannot climb the wall.
To climb, a model must take an Initiative test. If he
fails it whilst climbing up, he cannot move that turn.
If he fails it while climbing down, he falls from where

he started his descent (see the Falling section).
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Svenn
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 14:16

Yes, but the question is what counts as "touching"? Do you have to be next to a physical wall, or can you be "touching" a building by being inside/underneath the ledge you want to get up to?

Also, the rules state that you have to be touching what you want to climb at the beginning of your turn (ie you can't move to an object then climb up it the same turn). That is really annoying and pointless imo. It also makes people not want to climb as much, which defeats the purpose.
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 14:40

Svenn wrote:
Also, the rules state that you have to be touching what you want to climb at the beginning of your turn (ie you can't move to an object then climb up it the same turn). That is really annoying and pointless imo. It also makes people not want to climb as much, which defeats the purpose.

Which is why we have the house rule allowing us to climb as long as we have movement to move to the wall and make it up to the ledge.
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Wed 17 Jun 2009 - 15:34

I believe again the rules are clear. You need to be touching. If you are underneath an overhang type edge that is not touching. As noted by many they "house rule" it and I see it as a good house rule.

The rules say you must be touching what you want to climb. Standing underneath an overhang usually means (but not always) that you are not touching the wall you want to climb.

Pointless? Not even. Not everything is simple in battle.
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Thu 18 Jun 2009 - 2:58

An idea would be to allow Miniatures with a rope & hook to climp up to a lip (as it seems logical) where as without a rope & hook they can only scale sheer surfaces.

(This would simply add a further element of predictive hindsight and mean henchmen become marginally more expensive in return for more flexible climbing choices or limits the choice of climbing to specific individuals who you can afford the rope for)
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Thu 18 Jun 2009 - 3:36

We had this argument, I tried settling it by climbing onto a balcony wearing a rucksack (using the jump-and-grab technique you mentioned). But it was disqualified as proof as I wasn't carrying a sword, a gun and various other bits of kit. This got argued back and forth 'cos people in Mordheim can jump over all kinds of crazy shit, so in the end it was allowed.
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Sat 20 Jun 2009 - 20:29

haha, you actually demonstrated climbing techniques to argue your side of a rules dispute? that sir is a first!

I like the half movement jump climb as suggested above. I will adopt that... and yes poor Dwarves!

To add to the discussion, how do you all handle ladders?

Here is the quote to look at:

Spoiler:
 

If a ladder is more than your available move, for example you start 5"
away from a 6" ladder, will you stop half way up? I have
modeled all my ladders to fit bases to allow for this situation, but your terrain will dictate how you play.

Currently my group uses the following house rule: You may climb a ladder of any height (we have none over 8" so this is not an issue for our terrain) by using your entire movement as long as you started within an inch on it. If the height was not more than your movement you may still shoot.

I think we may change this, considering our terrain allow for it, to this: Ladders are open terrain, no need to be touching or an inch away at the start of your turn. While holding a ladder you may not shoot and must pass an initiative test of fall if hit by shooting. If charged you may choose to drop or fight with one hand. Remember to test for falling in injured!

Thoughts?
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Sun 21 Jun 2009 - 12:15

We usually allow anyone to climb the ladder as long as it fits in their movement, in the past we avoided being stuck on ladders but then again don't think we had any over 3" so odd of ending on a ladder were slim...

When we get more of our terrain setup and have larger buildings needing taller ladders this may come into play more often, and I like the idea of fighting from a ladder could make for some interesting combat.

I like the idea of having to pass a Initiative test if hit by shooting, but would you resolve the actual hit from the ranged attack before the fall? and what if you fall on other models under the ladder (if any) would they take a single str hit from the height of the fall?
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Mon 22 Jun 2009 - 18:47

IMO, I believe the original rule was to limit shooty warbands from getting to shooting platforms too soon. This, I think, is why you must stop after touching a building and try to climb the next turn.
Especially in a Skirmish scenario, the only way a hand to hand warband can do anything is to run the gauntlet. If the shooty warband gets up high too soon or too easily then the hand to handers won't stand much of a chance.

Also, along these same lines:
I've been in many games where tall buildings were in the deployment zone of a shooty warband and they all started on the 2nd, 3rd, or 4th floor. Getting a warband over there alive to fight them just was not possible. This is why in some games we have made a rule that you can only deploy on the ground floor during setup.
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PostSubject: Re: Climbing - What is acceptable (Ladders, Walls, etc)   Today at 14:46

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